method9455

I believe it is the BB hikeable park but I'm not really sure because I wasn't there - it just looks like that area of the mountain to me.

The gap to flat - down doesn't look outlandish but it does look like an advanced feature. If I were still riding I would hit it but it would be one of those things you check out once or twice, then you take a run at it pararell to the box to see if you got far enough before you take a run at it. Once you get the speed down its probably not bad at all. Or you could just take the bomb it fast approach and gap to the down but doesn't really look too bad. To me it looks like the best park Camelback has ever done - but still the worst in the Poconos. Thats saying a lot about the other mountains more than anything about Camelback because there was a time when the park Camelback has now would have us all raving. Too bad that time has passed and the bar is raising every year. I do think its moving in the right direction with the newer jibs and the park pass, thats a big step forward. Now it is a question of setups which is partly personal preference and partly standardized so if they rebuild it we'll see again. At least the improvement is there and I'm sure it would be fun for a handful of runs during the day, I just don't think anyone is going to go to Camelback for the park unless they are really local and don't want to drive. I couldn't really imagine being a park rider in that area and not jumping on 80 and going to JFBB or Shawnee over Camelback (its like 15 minutes to each one) so I don't think they want to try and compete for that market anyway.

Ha yea I dunno if liberal arts students will end up as the burger flippers but you certainly can say it to anyone who didn't graduate high school. And for the record I worked at McDonalds for 2-3 years when I was too young to work anywhere else, and that job SUCKS. I'm not really sure how I saved up so much money at $6 an hour but I worked a lot of hours at that place, and every hour I work in college to not have to end up in a job like that is entirely worth it.

I can see it from both perspectives. On one hand I know how mad I would be if I drove all the way up to do something and then it went badly. Then I would be more mad if I called to complain and got a bad answer on it. (For the record a similar situation happened to my family at Shawnee mountain, my brother dad and I ski but my cousins wanted to learn so they tried to get a lesson but couldn't, then tried to go tubing but the tickets were sold out, and ended up having a bad day at the mountain with nothing to do and we all left early and pissed off). So that sucks. But on the other when you compare the handling of this situation to that of Camelbacks (with I believe it was Ski's daughter who was under the height listed one place but not another) you have to realize that Bear Creek cares about the customers and I would say of all the mountains in our region you are likely to get the best service there. I wouldn't start your boycott until you've dealt with this all the way through because while Bear might not have the biggest mountain or the best weather I think it is fairly clear they have the best customer service representation on this website and care for their customers at the mountain better than all the other places.

Yea its about 3 degrees F per 1000 ft all things being equal so 500 feet = 1.5 degrees, that is quite a bit on marginal nights. Plus colder water at JF from the river helps. As for pitch - I would say East Mountain at JF feels equal in length to the stuff at Blue and is as steep if not steeper. Blue has a huge run out at the bottom that kills almost all of their vert advantage. You can definetly lap more at Blue in a shorter time because of the lifts, but I wouldn't say that you are getting more quality steep turns at Blue than you would at east mountain JF.

I mean I can see if its a snowboard shop why it would be only snowboard stuff - find a ski shop to help sponsor this stuff. As for skier versus snowboarder - you know what REALLY pisses me off? Both Burton and Ride sell stuff to "Snowboard only" shops (Burton Seven & UnInc boards, along with Coalition color schemes, Ride DFC edition stuff) that they won't sell to places that have skis - no matter what. If there is a ski in the place you can't carry it. So my shop which is a family owned shop thats really gets into the niche type stuff (we had grenade before they were big, almost picked up battaleon, have arbor, picked up Rome before most, etc etc) can't get some of the cooler stuff because we sell twin tips skis (almost half our ski wall is twin tip for both mens & womens). This despite Burton now sponsoring some twin tippers through Anon. But if your a skate shop that has just skateboard stuff and a tiny tiny bit of snowboard stuff - you can carry DFC & Coalition. Look at Small Empire. Hell I think Zoomies might have Coalition but we can't carry it because we support twin tippers at my store. Its such bullshit especially considering Anon goggles being worn by a lot of skiers, and the fact that some snowboard companies (GNU) are now starting to sell twin tips. I think we're past the point of this vendetta against ski culture and it annoys me that we lose sales to some stupid chain store because people want the Coalition color scheme - and that store has 1 guy who went snowboarding a bit, and we have a dozen guys picking this stuff out who are all serious riders/skiers, with two guys who used to be sponsored and a guy and a girl who were ski bums for a few years trying shit out, but because we sells skis too we get screwed.

Exposure has a lot to do with it. They could pile up 100 feet of snow - if it gets hit by the sun come March it will melt quick. A good example - Mountain Creek's Superpipe near the end of march, the riders right wall will be 2-3 feet shorter than the riders left wall because it gets the afternoon sun while the left wall gets the morning sun. It doesn't do much during Jan/Feb, but march the sun gets a hell of a lot hotter. Same thing last year they had 2 hips and the riders ride one was always slushy and the riders left was cold and icy. It takes a bit of planning but if around march they move all the snow features (jumps etc) to the shady side, and put jibs on the sunny side, more snow will last. Then as it melts out you can make the jumps smaller, then finally plow them out into a jib line in the shade and stretch it into April. Its not impossible - people used to hike up to Mountain Creek's jumps in exhibition at South because they were in the shade. One year it was May and people had shoveled a like 3 foot wide run into the table that was still there and were hitting it. Either last year or the year before they started plowing the jumps flat at the end of the season (which is lame) to prevent people from hiking, but prior to that a lot of people did it.

When I was a junior in High School the advisors for our ski club wanted to change to Camelback instead of Mountain Creek just for a change of scenery & how spread out MC is for a short night. We ended up getting 90 something percent of the kids in the ski club to petition to stay at Mountain Creek - sure glad we did.

A more judicious edit would be better. There are some good shots in it but a bunch of bad ones too. I've always thought that a 45 second clip of good shots was better than a 3 minute one of mixed stuff. Look at professional videos - they edit them down to 45 minutes when they probably have hours of shots that would WOW us, but by only doing the best stuff they raise the overall effect a bit. When you have too many shots it drags it down - especially if some of them are bails and what not. There is enough in that video with style to make a good 45 second clip - the shifty, the flat spin 360 with no grab that was smooth, one or two of the hip shots, without having to throw in the crappy boardslide and stuff.

I wonder how much a zaugg costs?

Why are you guys complaining about them? I'm about to rag on Camelback and I can't ski there once this season. I guess since I'm not getting out anymore this year I shouldn't post about any of the mountains because clearly it doesn't effect me. Or you can see this is a forum and there is no criteria to be allowed to talk in it so shut the fuck up. I don't hate on the rep, I appreciate hes here and I understand none of these are his decisions. I'm glad the marketing guys read what we're saying - I have to say Camelback does a good job of marketing. I see that billboard on Route 80 near Lodi and think - why doesn't Shawnee and JFBB have a sign? They're all on Route 80 - but Camelback is the only one with a sign on the busiest road coming from New York City. So clearly the marketing guys have their shit together and that means more tickets sold which means more snowmaking budget for everyone. But then decisions like this (not made by our rep or the marketing guys at all) are ridiculous and are the reason why we rag on Camelback. They have the best terrain out of the mountains out Route 80, but then they do stupid things that ruin it. Sure its unsafe for some people on one side of the mountain in these conditions - but its unsafe all the time on some trails so should you close those on ski club nights too? Maybe you should call up the schools and say hey its ridiculously cold tonight and it might be unsafe maybe you should reschedule. Or maybe someone should step on every bus that pulls in and give a little safety talk. My middle school went to Shawnee and you can get all the way out to the skiers left or right and be a pretty long trek from the base lodge - they didn't close lifts for the cold. In high school we went to Mountain Creek - that is a hell of a lot more spread out than Camelback ever is. You can be on Granite and be a long way from a base lodge. Not to mention the lift from South to Granite was timed at 11 minutes - and is very exposed. Yet they don't close that stuff because it is cold. The problem is the school kids not the weather, deal with the real problem.

My problem was actually when they filmed a kid doing a backside boardslide on a ride-on 8" wide box about a foot off the ground, and when he comes off the end he doesn't even turn his board straight he just lands on his heelside edge, and since hes going so god damn slow he doesn't fall. Sorry guys, I'll admit I don't film much and I also filmed myself when I wasn't doing great - but even the crappiest stuff I ever bothered to film is better than that, much less editing it into a video and posting it on the internet. Just don't waste your time because filming slows down your riding packing and unpacking the camera all day, just don't bring it and ride more.

I rarely rip on a video but those kids probably shouldn't waste their time filming

I tried it on my computer and someone elses and haven't been able to see it for like 2 days? Is it just my college or does it not work for anyone?

Well I don't doubt there are morons in it - I'm just saying that our school certainly tried to impress the seriousness of it upon us & I'm looking more at the astro side of it all so even more high risk when you start dealing with space and the sound barrier being far behind where you working.

Well sounds like Sno has put in a system similar to JFBB now that SMI designed it. The question is where do they get their water from, how are their temperatures usually, and considering Montage had crappy snowmaking do they have a solid snowmaking crew? It looks like they have been doing pretty good now that their season has gotten going.

I like gondola's for the social factor. You get a lot more people and at least once or twice a day you get involved in a malarious conversation. I had one lift this year at creek with 3 guys that fit the 'Da Bears' SNL skit to the T, including the 80s clothes & skis, and were bitching about their wives, the water slide at Mountain Creek that gave one of them an enema because he went down it so fast, and how bad they were at skiing, while drinking bud on the lift. I was laughing so hard on that lift it was great. Up in Canada - always ran into cool guys on the lift who were like 80 and snowboarding or locals who would tell you where to go. Generally you don't get that same conversation on a lift because its a few friends and maybe 1 stranger, or its cold and everyone is just quiet. I like meeting random people and talking a bit. Although sometimes it gets awkward - like when your on the gondola and two people are making out, thats a little weird.

Pssh I hate you, I was considering COC to make up for my lost season but the price wasn't worth it. $1200 for 3 days of riding plus airfare, or I could easily do a 5 day trip to Utah midwinter and a 4 day trip to Vermont and only spend like $200 more. It looks like a lot of fun but paying for it at $14 an hour just isn't worth it. I'm considering South Shore Soldiers now that I'm old enough since its the like 'adult' camp, plus its a lot cheaper, but I think COC has the best park & coaching of them all. Although I have a friend who went to Windells and swears by it, but that seems like the younger crowd and at 19 BC has the advantage of going to a bar at night.

Yea (sidenote for the spelling firefox 2.0 spellchecks on forums, it prevents you from looking like a dumbass its great) - I'm actually going into aerospace engineering and day one they kind of laid it out for us - if we make mistakes people die, much more so than anywhere else. Any little thing goes wrong on an airplane or a rocket and hundreds of people end up dead so I figure it's a good thing. As for BigDaddy - it would be lame for the forum if you switched to Sno since you post updates on JFBB so much, but they have clearly made huge improvements with their snowmaking and the vertical is better. I'll admit Doug I'm thinking about Blue a bit more I checked the distance again and its actually only 3 minutes further on googlemaps than JFBB - so I definetly fucked up last year when it took me like 2 and a half hours to get there. Although we did end up in a parking lot with a dumpster on fire, lost on a road that had nothing to do with any of our directions and without a map of PA (and none of us having been there) and stopped in the middle of the road to take a picture of a llama (shown below) , and despite the women in the car we DID NOT ask for directions and eventually made it to blue mountain. So we'll see maybe the solution is one pass for each mountain and not working next winter. As much as I like working at the shop it sucked up 4-5 days a week this winter I could have been snowboarding and I have all the gear I need now that all of this years stuff got packed away without any wear. As promised - llamas

wow backflip off an upslope rail - thats ridiculous. I'm saying it right now, no matter how long I snowboard I will never have the balls for that one.

I will give Camelback credit its the first time they have stuff in their park that is actually intimidating, usually everything is gap on so that is a step forward. I'd like to see more pictures, I was planning on riding there this year but unless they're open in April it won't be happening for me.

anyone have a picture of the channel gap?

Yea Paradise is one of my favorite trails there - and fuck that I'm skiing fast. If there is a crowd then sure I'm going to slow down, but I'll be damned if when the trail is super empty I'm going to go ridiculously slow on it just because there is a sign that says so. I cruise that trail with big turns and lots of speed and its great, and there is usually better snow there because people get scared on Challenge/Razors and end up plowing down the whole damn thing and scraping it off. That being said I didn't get whistled at last year but it would bother me if it were completely open and people started yelling at you. As for designated slow areas - Horizon at Mountain Creek is one and it is the most dangerous trail I've ever been on, not all that wide, steep enough to pick up some speed, and intersects almost every trail on the mountain so to get from one black to another you have to cross it. You have a steady stream of people going across it perpendicular at a high speed to go from a black to a black, a steady stream of people going fast DOWN it, and then clumps of people falling on it. All the while there are "Slow Skiing" signs and few patrollers around - and never a whistle to be heard. Maybe they should export the red coats to Mountain Creek because that is a place that actually needs traffic lights or something the way the crowds are, its insane.

I see what Ski is saying about having the features up high with sloped sides as an injury measure (see Blue's swingset box, despite everyones bitching - it has slopped sides so if you WHERE to come off the top it wouldn't hurt that bad). As compared to the 48' battleship box at MC last season: Although the swingset box is higher, i've come off the top of the that box and it looks a lot lower than it is, and it is onto a flat deck so it compresses your knees quite a bit when you aren't expecting it. However for stuff like a flat down, there isn't really a NEED for it to be up high like that. It could be 2 feet above flat snow the whole way and be fine, unless the contour of the slope doesn't match the box, then you need to build up a mound. To me the 8' gap onto the flat down looks fun. I'd set it up less on a mound like that, more on the contour of the hill, with the same gap, and a wider/higher lip. Then the preferred move would most likely be gap to the down with a lot of speed, take it like a 20' jump, or you could go onto the flat and go down it, but most likely take it as a gap to down rail which would be very sick indeed. This is an interesting setup too: Its setup like I said before, a wide ramp with like an 8' gap - and then look there is a streestyle ramp on the down part so you would roll in AROUND the first lip, and take the down section as a streetstyle down rail. That would be fairly innovative around here.

No I totally agree, not to be a dick but the quality of riders at JFBB isn't too high yet. That probably has a lot to do with the way their parks have just been starting to grow the last few years. If you see people throwing down really good stuff 9 times out of 10 they're not from JFBB. The kids who are really good and are locals are all jibbers, even watch the videos they post up none of them are hitting the big jumps. You go to Mountain Creek any day of the week there are kids throwing 7's and 9's over the biggest jumps, and then you go to JFBB and there aren't even many people hitting the jumps. Granted there are more kids overall at Creek so you will get a few more stand outs from a bigger crowd, but the parks at Creek have been established for a long time and I would say that JFBB has been rumbling for a while but didn't really explode until this year. Give it two years, I think JFBB is going to seriously eat into Mountain Creek's supply of riders. Already there is a huge amount of people switching, and not only that but a lot of people at MC talking about going out to visit JFBB where before they weren't even on the radar.