method9455

I'm amazed JF was able to make snow without one, it just defies the laws of nature. I actually am pretty sure Mountain Creek got screwed this year because someone through big granny panties on their bra tree last year and ruined the snow god's favor.

Ha yea I left for dinner and came back and finished up the post and then realized I had hit submit when I left even though I hadn't added the map. Question about Elevator - I was looking at the older trail map and it looks like it runs parallel to the trail that has been opened on East Mountain all the time. I've never been to JF before this year so its hard to say exactly what is what when their map isn't super accurate. When I was going up there was a trail intersection about midway on the left hand side of the chairlift, and there was a seemingly really steep trail - is that Elevator? I hope its something else because it looked like a hell of a lot of fun when it is covered with snow. But it is a full width trail angled like 30 degrees to the east of the trail that was open, where on the map Elevator looks more like a small trail separated by just a few trees- so did I miss elevator? I would be disappointed if that trail I saw doesn't open because it looked liked a lot of fun.

Ha did he bend the rail? that sucks. Oh yea and on the aluminum thing - yea learned that the hard way. What a fucking bad move to try that out. Flat-down-flat-down-flat rail, aluminum, round, shaky, and had a wall right next to the landing that you had to clear and a gaurd rail on the entrance. I think the only reason we tried it was because it was really local. Basically ended up either bouncing off from the shaking or catching an edge on that first down, what a horrible day. Now that I found out about the whole aluminum sucks for sliding and you catch and edge thing - I don't feel so bad about how miserably we did.

Well this thread is about on the verge of shit hitting the fan/turning into a stupid internet brawl but I'll reiterate another time. The problem with a setup like Camelback's is that it is plain dangerous. We aren't asking them to commit more terrain, more snow, or more money. We're asking they just push the snow a little bit differently and let the park crew set things up the way we know they can so that it is safer for everyone. Here is how beginners hit rails: Line up with the rail. Go pretty slow in a straight line for it. Don't jump, allow the ramp to lift you up on the rail. Get on the rail, slide to the end. Maybe fall on the landing, maybe ride away. Get stoked. Here is how advanced people hit rails: Setup higher up, make maybe 1 or 2 carves on the approach. Have much higher speed Take the rail from the side, between 3-12" from the edge of the rail and land on it Rotate onto the rail into whatever slide you are doing. Rotate off the end of it back to straight now the beginners aren't morons, it takes a lot of coordination to do it right. So why can't we do anything with camelback's rails? They are too narrow to setup from the side. They are too short for us to take them with the speed we are accustomed to, and they are too low for us rotate easily. I'm not saying it can't be done because it can, but on a really short/low rail when you are going fast things happen so quickly because the end is there in half a second, that you don't learn anything. When you are on a 40 foot box you are there for maybe 3 seconds which is a hell of a lot more than half of one. The first 6-8 feet of a box are eaten up by us landing. The last 6-8 is us preparing to come off. That middle section doesn't exist on a small box and that is the part where you are sliding! Additionally - if people are used to ride on rails, as the day goes on the lip gets worn down. Then people can't just get on by riding into it, and the nose of their snowboard hooks the end of the rail because they are too low - instant front flip. If they have lined up straight into the rail like I said before - instant front flip into slamming into a rail. Believe me I know about this - i was clearly a begginer too. Here is my snowboard that I jacked up from going straight into a rail instead of from the side. Led to a nice front flip into the rail and me feeling glad I was wearing a helmet even though I got up and had a really bad headache.

Yea some day when I'm older and rich and retired early as a ski bum (or maybe I should just become a ski bum and skip this college/job bullshit) I'm going to be a patroller. But not a "I'm a wanna-be cop" patroller (not saying all patrollers are, but there certainly are some) but a West Coast avalanche patrol & medical type guy. For that I'm going to be on skis. Its hard to do the sled with a board, its hard to do a lot of the avalanche work without skis, you can't traverse well on a board, just a lot of things that make inconvenient for a patroller.

Sounds good. Boarder cross trail will be a fun change, haven't seen one done well since Mount Snow used to do one back when they had the X-Games and a few years after. Even the little banks at Blue last year where fun and the rollers MC had once in a while where mad fun.

This was my progression: Dial 50-50s, land them 100% of the time. When you get into board slides try what they're saying - rotating on the jib, but that won't quite get you there. When you get to the part where you are jumping and rotating at the same time, move slightly to the side of the rail. If you are coming in backside, think your heel edge is in line with the outer edge of the box so you are slightly off center but just a tiny bit. Now when you roll in and jump/rotate, your body naturally will move a little bit towards the rail so it will straighten everything out. You should also aim like your taking a jump and want to land right on the end of the rail, this will help you slide the whole thing clean. The advantage of this is twofold, first it is harder to catch an edge this way because you will be jumping over the rail later since you are coming in from the side. Second, it is easier to progress up from here - now when you go into street style or downslope and other bigger rails - the coming at it from the side isn't an issue and you won't have to overcome and bad reflexes - and in the beggining it doesn't matter how you start really. As for on the box - the lower you get the easier it is. The faster you go, the easier it is because you are on the box for less time so you have to balance for less time. Thats why you see a lot of people rocketing down rails - it is way easier to do. This is especially true of big down rails, if you just go faster you will air out farther and have to do less of the rail and have to jump lower. This isn't me ripping on people for going too fast to make it easy - this is me saying the only way to make the big stuff possible is to go much faster than you would think is the right speed.

Are they elminating cross mountain because they don't want kids from the park going onto Tannenbaum? Or just to say they're 100% open? It is definitely still on the trail map - although other mountains have eliminated trails and it took awhile to fade off their trail maps (Granite View died this year at Mountain Creek, but its still on the map). Its weird cuz they said they were 100% when cross was still marked as closed, but the cutting things off at JF is just shady. To say we have 100o% of our trails open is one thing, but no one would expect your glades to be open anyway so it could be like 100% trails, no glades for now, and when it snows they could make a big deal about it again. http://www.onthesnow.com/ski/trailmap_photos/190_window.jpg apparently skimaps.com is gone, which is very disappointing.

Are they elminating cross mountain because they don't want kids from the park going onto Tannenbaum? Or just to say they're 100% open? It is definitely still on the trail map - although other mountains have eliminated trails and it took awhile to fade off their trail maps (Granite View died this year at Mountain Creek, but its still on the map). Its weird cuz they said they were 100% when cross was still marked as closed, but the cutting things off at JF is just shady. To say we have 100o% of our trails open is one thing, but no one would expect your glades to be open anyway so it could be like 100% trails, no glades for now, and when it snows they could make a big deal about it again.

They should put plastic on the sides so if it ends up sucking they can turn it and use it as a wallride.

yea YouTube turns things into crap, but hey its free so who cares?

Sick, as soon as I'm back at school I'm going to be hitting Bear every friday and I'm stoked for it. (Anyone with no friday classes?)

yea actually the first few cuts aren't even close to full height on the wall - if you look on the zaugg it does a bit of the floor too. If they don't have extra height to work later what happens is you actually get like a W shape - there is a bump in the middle from running the zuagg over the walls so many times - it makes a drainage ditch at the bottom of the wall and then the middle of the pipe is higher. It has happened to some pipes late season after a lot of cutting on the walls if they're not careful - and it is very hard to correct other than scraping out the middle of the pipe which is bad for obvious reasons. 13 foot should be a pretty good size. Although superpipes are a lot easier - they suck up so much snow its not all that practical. I think having an extra 3 days of riding on a 13 foot pipe is better than the amount of days you can get on a super pipe. Plus most people are scared off by a super pipe - which is nice cuz the grooming holds up- but the first few times they drop in they learn nothing other than holy crap a 19 foot drop in is high.

Shawnee said they're building their park first, then the pipe so I dunno. Also not sure about Bear no one has hit it. Hunter doesn't even have theirs open yet but they're close, the Hunter blog today showed the pipe full of snow but uncut. Still haven't even heard if Creek is going to open the Superpipe this year, I'm not sure - the weather looks solid for the next few weeks so its possible the mountains around here will fully recover from the crappy start, just depends on management commitment. No mountains are allowed to close with enough snow left on the ground after this crappy start - any that do will lose their pass holders in droves. This especially applies to Mountain Creek and Camelback who have been closed more often than the others, as well as being notorious for closing before they have to.

Well Ben you started the thread talking about how vocal people here on the site are - not the population in the park as a whole. Believe me I ride the park at Mountain Creek and if you want to find a group of morons - go there. The place is basically the equivalent of the Jersey Shore West. Within that population are the real riders - people there from before it was cool, who understand progression. You find some skaters who do it in the winter who are clearly different because they ride all park and don't really go for powder and moguls etc, but also get the progression thing and are fun to hang with. Then there is a large group of people who are trying to be "cool" and "hardcore" and crap like that. They're loud, flashy, and generally can't ride all that well. It is hard to distinguish them from the actual good riders who set style because they look similar, but these posers can usually be found throwing down on really wide boxes that take very little skill, and not being able to do rails or jumps because they can't actually ride. The people on this side largely fall into the actual rider side - we aren't just in it for Park and we understand weather - so we complain about the park because it is one thing under their control right now. You stirred up a shit storm because you basically attacked us for trying to get some change done, if you don't want to read out threads then don't read them. I'm on the fence with the CB park crew, sometimes it seems like they know what they're doing, and sometimes they seem lazy. I think there were a few idiots like 2 years ago and the crew now is fine - but management talks a lot more than they act when it comes to setting up a park. We'll see what happens when Rhodo opens up, but I don't think it will compare well.

In the words of Jeremy Jones: "It's crispy" Looks different from the JFBB/Mountain Creek/BC mold, I can't wait to ride it. The swingset box looks massive. The bus looks pretty damn buried without much shape around it which speaks for the depth of the base on the trail. That last setup with the 4 rails next to each other will be sweet, got to get 3 friends and hit it together.

Isn't the streetstyle round rail new?

To be fair kids gloves aren't nearly as warm as adult ones. Almost all kid winter clothes are horribly constructed because the cost is low and they get replaced annually for the most part - and they don't expect kids to be out in the brutally cold like adults do. At least at my shop - we carry great stuff but the kids gear just isn't even close.

Hey I liked it. I was looking at what was at Sno - not really expecting the sundance film festival when I see things on YouTube anyway.

Hey the pictures are better than nothing. can't really tell whats where - but there is a hell of a lot of snow in there.

I don't get the whole patroller/ranger whistle/yelling things at Camelback & Blue. I'm used to Mountain Creek - no matter how fast you go no one cares. The only time they are an issue is when you go out of bounds they clip tickets. I had a run in once for riding the bike trail under the gondola one year when there was actually snow, but the guy was pretty chill about it. More along the lines of - don't want people who can't do it trying it and getting hurt, than flipping out. It just seems unnecessary - if I want to get treated like these guys do I'll just do 120 in my car on 287 and get a ticket, its ridiculous.

Ben to put it bluntly - I don't think you can read. Sure the words pass before your eyes, but you can't comprehend anything we're saying. That or you basically hate all the kids in the park and don't actually listen to anything being written here, so when it contracts what you think you just ignore it. So read this post and see if you GET it. First when you talk about people being vocal on here, you are talking about me, you are talking about toast, and glenn, and a bunch of other guys who aren't stupid. I take that somewhat personally - because I feel I'm the farthest from an entitled brat you can get. Toast is at Moravian as you can see in his signature which is a hard college. I'm on an academic full ride to University of Delaware, not sure about Glenn but he obviously is intelligent too. We're not the average idiot in the park (although there are some on here too) - so don't think those guys are on PAskiandride bitching about it. If you think I'm too vocal about this - you should hear me when I care about something dearly (if you listen to the Rush Limbaugh show, watch Fox News Channel, ABC, NBC or CBS - you could have seen or heard me. If you read the Daily Record or the Star Ledger you can read my letters to the editor - so I care about a lot more than snowboarding). If you want to talk about entitlement - I've been working since I could legally and before that, and have bought a car, 5 snowboards & some bindings & boots, 2 sailboats, 2 computers, and all my lift tickets and season passes for the last 5 years. Not sure how many kids work 30+ hours on top of high school, but I'm one of them so believe me I don't feel entitled to anything. Except maybe the scholarships I got after working so fucking hard when everyone around me coasted through high school. So don't think we're vocal because we're whiny brats who don't know how to get what we want. I wanted to go to college for free - and 5 places offered to let me do it. So if you think me complaining about snow being pushed around wrong because I'm used to being handed what I want - it doesn't work that way The point of the matter is - like Glenn and others have said my progression is at a dead end. I skied from age 3-13, including racing and park. Then I switched to snowboarding for the last 5 years. Winter sports for me are just a way of pushing myself and progressing. When you look at the park why would anyone want to hit rails anyway? Sliding on a box is boring! The only outcome is getting to the end or getting hurt. So why do we do it? Because it PUSHES us. At the start even the smallest jumps and rails scared me. I remember the first time I got over a little ride on battleship rail at Mountain Creek after about dozen tries, how it felt to overcome that fear. How it felt to do the big gap on rail there two years ago on Khyber - a huge ollie with potential to break your leg if you came up short. It felt so good to get on top and slide it. So when its 3 or 4 am and I've been working since 9am on a project at school, and I'm exhausted and just want to go to bed, what makes me stay up when the other kids just went to bed? I think back to how I broke my nose that time on a rail and got back up and did it again before I went to the doctor - because I didn't want that rail to beat me. Sure there are guys there just trying to look cool - I hate them too. But I'm there to push myself so I can go to my limits. The difference between those that get ahead and those that are left behind is how hard we push ourselves. I am not a very naturally talented snowboarder - in fact I'm not mostly just persistent and not all that athletic. Stuff comes to other people in half the time it takes me to land it. But I'm out there pushing myself, and then I go home and push myself in my school work. Thats why I'm the only guy from my high school clearing big jumps and big rails, and I'm one of the very few in my college with a 4.0. And all I'm asking is that the mountains help us with our progression a bit. And why do we complain about Camelback doing it wrong when JFBB and Bear and Mountain Creek do it right? Because sometimes I do like to go and ride steeper and longer stuff too, and I like to go with my Dad who introduced me to it all so long ago, and we might go to the park once in a day and I'll show a few of my new tricks and he thinks its cool, but the other 95% of the day we're out riding the regular stuff. But that one time through the park it is more dangerously setup than the much bigger things elsewhere. On the pragmatic side - it doesn't take much snow to do this. I built a 15 foot and a 10 foot rail for my backyard and a drop in box, and if it snowed more than 2 inches I could have a setup. It meant a hell of a lot of shoveling, but it could be done. The ramp for a rail takes about 25 foot diameter circle of snow when its in the 2-4" depth, (of natural snow) and then shoveled together and packed down to be about 4 feet wide, 3 feet long, and 6 inches high on top of the trail. About the same amount of snow as 2 moguls. So don't compare setting up a rail to having an entire mogul field or having a trail open for man made powder for a day, or a long groomer. It is totally different. Generally we are complaining about the way in which they setup the ramps, not the amount of snow used or anything. When the mountain is balancing priorities, it is one thing to pick blowing snow on Marjies versus Rhodo - fine. But when you have a "park" open, the snow has been blown, and it just sucks, that is a problem. The snow is there on the ground, the rails are sitting in the garage, and the park crew is standing there, with their hands tied. Where exactly is the entitlement? When I go up and spend $50 for a lift ticket when I'm making $15 an hour and I get to the park and it sucks - what entitlement is that?

That sucks dude, although its not unheard of. A jump the size of the one at JF can seriously fuck you up. Both my brother and best friend have face planted jumps that size and it was nasty. My brother's nose was bleeding like a river and my best friend fucked up his neck and had to do some therapy for a while although he is ok and back riding now - although he won't do the park anymore. So always check that shit out, sorry about your injury man that sucks.

Not sure if I'm allowed this shameless plug but since I'm going to back to school and won't be at work anymore to beneifit: High country sports in livinginston has snowskates mad cheap because we over ordered the last two years and - there hasn't been any snow so no one is buying them. You can pick up the Burton Junkyard double decker kind for $65 instead of $100+. Call them up to see if there are some left, but there were at least 4 double deckers at that price, and a bunch of the cheap one level ones too. They are the 2nd best snowskate you can buy (the 1st being the GNU snowskates with magne-traction so they can actually carve a bit too) Anyway, if anyone is thinking about doing it now that there is a park for it and don't want to rent one, $65 will be paid off in like 3 or 4 times and if it snows in your backyard they are mad fun.

#1) Its not a superpipe, its a small one. #2) The ironic thing is we're actually asking them to use LESS snow in the park - because none of us like ride on rails. A gapped rail would require less snow.