method9455

Certainly not this weekend (Nov 14/15). And nothing looking good in the forecast now either. And it is 65 out. Damn it.

Fair enough, I just saw him making fun of GSS which I'm sure Doug could more than handle and TTC6 was receiving a lot of shit from a bunch of people to warrant it imo. And I'm pretty sure that TTC6 and Ski would have killed each other becuase Ski used to argue with Papasteeze most I feel, and both Papa and TTC6 are very pro-JFBB and park oriented so I could imagine "How are the jump lines at Sno" threads could have gotten ugly real fast. But I would have seriously enjoyed that.

Pants seem mad over priced to me. You could take off half the pockets and get the same functionality with a hell of a lot less labor. You aren't paying $150 for the material.

Just a note with that, make sure you are buying something with the right DIN range for your weight if it is used and it helps if the bindings don't have to be remounted, that will add quite a bit to the price if you are talking skis for $100, remount is what, something like $50?

Honestly I don't get it. I only watched the first like 5 seconds intro and not the rest of it, I'll check it out monday. But my impression is, seriously, you made a back country HALF PIPE? What is the point? So you can hit the same feature but surrounded by better scenery for the helicopter to film?

You are so lost you don't even see when you are getting owned. I have a better board than the Vapor. The lightest board with a wood core, magne traction, and the added bonus is I paid $250 for a $950 board - at a general sale not through connections. I post under my real name, and link to my Facebook, because I stand by everything I write. Though not sure where you get the mustache comment from, are you incapable of even following links? I have 2-3 long reasoned posts in this thread and I haven't seen you try to disagree with a word of any of them, other than trying to insult me and say how awesome of a rider you are. Which one of us is the joke? (And have you ever noticed that there is a direct relation between when just how owned someone is getting in an arguement or debate and how loud they start screaming THIS IS OVER, DON"T EVEN ARGUE I'VE WON!)

They only sell one item as a time. If you look later it will be something else. Danny Kass's home mountain WAS mountain creek. Lots of guys start small. But he moved to Mammoth. If you are still living the dream, and you are a local at Camelback, something is wrong with your dream. At least DHarrisburg is in Utah I believe. Thats living the dream.

TGR has incredible content to but I never post there. I guess it is a more western centric board too so I don't have an opinion, but it just doesn't seem like a place worth talking in unless I have a specific question.

Get a little closer to this : http://satabyte.com/?p=986

It is not always clear cut to buy rather than rent. It really depends on how often you are moving because of the cost of buying/selling/closing a mortgage and also the cost the cost of borrowing money. http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/10/business/2007_BUYRENT_GRAPHIC.html Or as many people painfully found out, houses don't always go up. -Edit though on 2nd thought, that calculator doesn't seem to take into account what you recover upon selling a house. Over a longer term it is obviously better to buy for that reason, I was using it to answer the question on 1-5 year time frame where the increased value of the house is basically nil.

I miss Ski and TTC6 immensely. I think they both had a lot in common. They were big proponents of Sno and JFBB respectively, passionate about their opinions, and disagreed with the "cool kids" on PASR. And they both had a bit of a temper problem. Didn't Ski have a story about punching some guy out in the parking lot who said something about his daughter? And we know TTC6's stories. But without them we have a fairly one dimensional community. You say he crossed the line. But there isn't A line, it is YOUR line. Whatever the moderator's of a particular message board set as a line is the line. That doesn't mean all the members of the board agreed with the line. A good example is GSS, he got banned from AlpineZone for a flippant comment that I agreed with, and AZ is worse off for it. Basically the moderators there just didn't like him becuase they're all uptight and used that as an excuse to ban him. I feel like the TTC6 situation was the same way. The whole week leading up his banning other members were antagonizing the hell out of him and the moderators not only didn't stop it but participated in it, and then you turn around and ban him when he hits back because he finally hits too close to home and pisses some people off. I think he had some points at times and that if you cut through the BS he was an average person and actually wanted to ski with people - another thing people antagonized him for because he wanted to do it a little different than everyone else. A better solution would be to not ban him and if he said something that was so damn rude, just censor it. And then he'll bitch about it but you can at least be like this is an example of the reasons why you are losing your welcome here. Instead its like bring down the ban and lock all the threads related that not only he screwed up or about him getting kicked and just cut off the discussion. I feel like the same vibe is directed at a few other people who are old standing members but they haven't done anything egregious enough to give the mods an excuse. I don't remember what Ski did, I just remember the fights he and Papasteeze had were comedic gold and often informative in some respect. And he was as prolific a poster as GSS in terms of daily reports, the Sno forum is basically dead now. He single handedly got me interested in that mountain, and now had some great information. Whatever he did wasn't worth losing that contribution to the place. Basically if you take out the personalities, and especially the conflict, you have a much less interesting board. In the off season we're basically dicking around which is why I took PASR out of my "check it everyday" bookmark set until the fall rolls around again. If its the same 10 people talking and everybody agrees, not very interesting except to read TRs here and there. There is certainly some barrier that needs to be set or else you get a mess like TGR. But the majority of the people on that site are assholes. If we have 1-3 guys on here who fight with everyone, I don't think thats a bad thing because we all recognize them. There is a big difference between TTC6 and GSS arguing in a thread because they always argue and a bunch of random people arguing with each other for no reason. One is funny because of the plot and one is just noise around good information. I guess you can talk about what the impression is on new people, but I don't think it is a big turn off. This is the most civil forum I'm on except for the Subaru Forester forum I joined but that is just people explaining how to do maintenance on their cars. Anything where you can have an opinion is way worse than this board with the fights and insults.

I made the switch back last year. I was a skier from like 4-12, snowboarded from 13-21, and now I'm doing both. I bought the whole setup but that was because I was at the shop and got about $1200 worth of gear for $250, but skiing is crazy expensive compared to snowboarding. It was not the best approach, my skis are way too stiff for me right now because I am a total noob again. I'm sure I would be progressing faster on softer skis than what I am right now. Once I get better I will have a set of twins that are good for freeriding pretty hard and a little bit of powder/jumps (Line Prophet 90s for anyone who cares), but for right now they are too much for me. I would say absolutely buy the boots. Get boots, and get footbeds. Rental boots suck. They are sloppy becuase they are packed out and they are cold/uncomfortable, plus you are sharing boots with other people. No thanks. Get like a lower intermediate boot, don't cheap out but the stiff boots at the top are totally unnecessary until you start charging stuff really hard. I would expect to spend $250-350 for new boots. I have tried on a lot over the years, I'm a fan of Technica and Dallbello because of my foot shape but just go into a good shop and talk to the guy, try some on, you'll find something you like. Then rent skis for the season. You can get good enough skis for the year but daily rentals are a waste of time & money. If you actually want to progress you'll go at least a half dozen times. For the actual experience of skiing, at first it was very easy. Before I stopped I could do any trail in PA and 360s and had raced a bit. Going back to it, I had pizza/fries down after the first 100 feet and was doing decent regular turns in like 5 runs. But after that progress was very slow. I put in like 4-5 days last year and I could get down a black diamond but I wasn't carving well by any stretch of the imagination. Up at Stowe I was doing blues as long as they were groomed, but moguls beat me up. I did a few jumps at JFBB and landed them but that was probably a mistake so I can get some speed and stop, but my turns just aren't good. I'm thinking this year it is time for a lesson. So if you are a never-ever skier, then I'd get a lesson on day 1 or go with someone who knows how. Just flailing at it will suck. If you have skied but are trying to remember, I'd get a lesson after a few days so that you can kind of remember how to do it and build up the muscles and then get the best bang for your buck after you hit that wall of what you remember. There are some decent videos on YouTube for instruction too. The funniest part is I have absolutely no idea what to do with poles. Literally I just flop them around like a complete moron. It feels so awkward now. If anyone could explain what you are supposed to be doing with them in this thread, that would be great. As for the tele gear, that is one of my primary motivations for this whole switch back. I want to be able to access stuff and I think it is easier than a split board. But now they are making some bindings that are like tele when you skin but you can lock the heel on the way down, seems like the best of both worlds. Some of my friends have this model and used them in Utah for a week of BC stuff with no problems. http://www.markerusa.com/duke16.php

Whatever man, my goal is to help people. I did that through teaching people directly and I did that through helping people get the right gear back when I worked in a shop. I have sold hundreds of boards, bindings, skis, boots of both kinds etc. I am satisfied that I always advised in good faith for what was right for the person after I did my best to figure out what they were trying to do and what their skill was. I like to think I helped a lot of people in that time with everything from lessons to quick tips in the store to info on where to go on a trip. I know a lot of people came back and asked for me so I must have been doing something right. Today I do product design on things that overlap with a lot of the ski/snowboard technology and I am in a lot of discussions on engineering, marketing, and business. I can back up every one of my points I made about the Vapor with a set of facts - from Burton's own catalog ratings and guys like Terje and Muller picking the T6 over the Vapor to my experience riding them, or some opinions that make logical business or engineering sense. I can tell you don't give a shit about any of that and just want to make some extra bucks off an unsuspecting buyer. All you have said really is that you are great at snowboarding and we all suck so you therefore know more than us about the boards. Nobody cares. You might be better than anyone else here - there are still plenty of people better than you. If you are peddling used boards your friends on a team had last year it sounds like you are just a hanger-on chasing a dream for the last 19 years that hasn't worked out so well. Pathetic. When it comes to selling the boards, I can tell without a doubt I could take $800 and get a better match for ANYONE, regardless of their skill from total noob to ripper and you'd have some money left over to actually go ride.

Not snowmaking, but other stoke from Mount Snow in the last few days

Shit 18 years getting free stuff from the industry and you still ride crappy boards? Get some lessons! And I was never interested in your board, I was just making sure you don't steal any money from PASR members.

Stowe or Jay. I did Killington, Stratton, Mount Snow, and Stowe last year. Stratton, Mount Snow, and Killington have the advantage of a shorter drive. Thats it. So if you are going for more than a weekend go to Stowe or Jay. As for HR policy, it is probably forbidden officially. But fuck that, it happens all the time. My dad took a bunch of ski/fishing/car racing trips with suppliers for his previous company. I even went on a few of them and I don't even work there. This is how business works - its just like corporate box seats or golf outings. If they are doing what you need from them on the supply side and you aren't picking them over a superior supplier just because of the trips, I'm all for it. Life is too short to let HR nannies cramp an opportunity to have fun at work when there is nothing actually wrong with it.

I am slowly starting to realize that experiences are worth more than stuff. I heard it a long time ago, but it so hard to believe that when I walk into a ski shop and look at all the boards. So I'd say take $5,000 and take a sweet vacation, put the other $15,000 away. Take another 5,000 for the next 3 years and have 4 awesome vacations.

Busting out the snowmaking wet bulb chart for the year from Bear Creek. Going with an average of Accuweather, NOAA, and Weather.com I get about: Thursday night - 25 and mostly cloudy, 70% humidity. Friday night - 29 and mostly cloudy, 70% humidity. Looks like it will be possible both nights. Based on the cloud cover it won't be great though, those windows might be very small. Daily highs in the upper 40s doesn't help either. I could see them making some snow for marketing/publicity reasons but not a real push for an opening unless the forecast improves a bit. Looks like a better window opens Nov 12th on, but again that is far out so the forecast is not very solid.

I get pissed when someone says I don't know what I'm talking about when I definitely do. I want to talk about selling boards. He wants to talk about being a better rider than me. This thread is about selling boards and he doesn't know jack about the board he is selling compared to other boards, how to properly price it, or why Burton makes the Vapor.

You are probably a better rider than me, but you definitely aren't better at selling boards. Shop carry these boards, my shop has carried these boards for years. We sell them NEW at prices lower than you are selling your USED shit ones. Year after year after year. Your prices are a fucking joke. I have ridden the Vapor, I have ridden the T6, I don't like the Vapor in a straight up comparison between the two and if you add in price, forget it. If your only metric is light weight, then sure the Vapor is the best. But is the only thing it has going for it. If you metric is stiffness, then the Vapor absolutely doesn't win. The reason the Vapor is lighter is because they altered the construction of everything on top of the core. The core and base are basically the same as a T6, and then on top of the core there is less fiberglass in the Vapor. That makes it less durable and less stiff. If you don't believe me on this, go look in the official Burton catalog. The Vapor is rated 6/10 on stiffness, the T6 8/10 and the Custom X 7/10, and the regular Custom is 5/10. So the Vapor and the Custom/Custom X are closer in stiffness than the Vapor and the T6. Your problem is that you are correlated price with performance. For a long time when snowboard companies made boards and put a margin on them, it worked out that the most stiff ones were the most expensive becuase the materials used were more expensive. That has changed and price is connected to a number of factors, materials being one of them but pricing has a lot more to do with segmentation in the market than anything else. I never said reps are smart/good riders whatever. Though a bunch of former ski reps work for my dad as sales reps, and I went on a ski trip with them to Canada once and they were all pretty nasty. Nor are they very smart. But they know how to sell boards or they wouldn't have their job. So when they are telling sales guys who to sell the boards to - they don't get fired for that they get promoted. Telling us who and how to sell the Vapor is exactly what Burton wants them to be doing. If you don't think the design of the Vapor comes from the top down based on a marketing position then you are sadly mistaken. It fits the mold of a premium product aimed at the most affluent - not the best - segment of the market to a T. You find this in cars, boats, golf clubs, everything. It has a "feature" that is really noticeable, gives you that "wow" feeling when you hold it in the store. It also MAKES THE PERSON BUYING IT A BETTER RIDER. Largely the people spending the most money at the store are NOT the best riders/skiers. Ever. They're the guys going to Vail over Christmas week and maybe they'll go to Utah for a week later in the year. They buy intermediate stuff and don't blink at prices. There are a whole lot of skis aimed at this market and now that snowboards have matured, Burton is getting in on the act. Ride has been in this area for a while with their top 2 boards. Burton is expanding here as well. The guy who comes in and tells me he is riding 2-3 times a week because he has a season pass somewhere and rides 60% park and is looking to replace his park board he snapped in half - that guy is nasty at riding and DOES blink at the price. And that guy is never buying a Vapor. He doesn't want one, and I'm not going to try and push one on him. It doesn't make it a BAD board, it just makes it a board that most clearly aligns with intermediate riders. It is a medium flexing board. Just because some pros rock it doesn't make it an "advanced" board. It's not like an "advanced" rider can't ride an "intermediate" board, but I'm sure if you put an intermediate rider on some stiff advanced board, they are going to hate it because they won't be able to turn. As an example, the Cartels are clearly a more advanced binding than the Custom, yet Shaun White rides on Custom bindings. That doesn't make them "advanced" bindings, they are aimed at beginner/intermediate riders, he just specifically likes them better because of the flex. The Vapor is most clearly descendant from the P1 binding, a soft intermediate binding that has some extra features and is inordinately priced compared to the extra features. They feel soft and plus in the store and it seems worth the money, but if you try them out your boot (hell even the way you lace up) has more to do with comfort than the gel in the binding. The P1 is too heavy though so it didn't go with the Vapor and they made the C02 bindings that fit the style, but that whole category of thought is where the Vapor came from.

Great movie, I'll be a concert so I can't make it but I recommend going, get to see a bunch of PA skiing.

The stairs drive me crazy. I won't ride up them when they is even a little bit of the stair out so I don't beat the hell out of my board, some people don't care about their gear but I do so I have to unstrap, walk up, restrap. Ugh. It would definitely be better with an orange fence with 1 opening 3' wide and a BIG sign, one half smarstyle, and the other half "rules for observers" or something like that -Do not sit on or cross landings of features -Do not jump off the sides of ramps -Do not cross in front of those riding into features. That would do it. It would stop some percentage of people who don't understand what they are doing wrong, and for everyone else that continues to do it at least then we can say "go read the sign". Right now if you stop someone and tell them what they are doing wrong, they will get into an argument about it and make it look like you were wrong. I saw some like 4 y/o kid almost get killed when he was doing the pizza across the landing of a big jump at Boulder, so I went down to his dad and I was not yelling but I was like come on man you gotta watch your kid he almost got hit in the head by some guy in the park. And he whips around and yells at me FUCK YOU downhill skier has right of way! That is true but it is PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE for me to see your 2' high child on the backside of a 10' ramp. I can have all the best intentions in the world, but after the first jump in a jump line you are overtaking so many people you can not have a solid reading on the situation on the landing unless you had a spotter on every jump. So what for a 3 jump line you get 4 people and 1 hits the jumps each time through? Like that would happen. It's a lot like in a boat - there are all these rules of the road about who can go where when, but if there is a big ass ship coming your way I don't care if I have rights or not, I'm getting the hell out of the way. Defensively, the best thing you can do is not work off the center of a jump ramp. Someone could be sitting anywhere, but if some noobie went off the ramp in the middle and is laid out on the knuckle he probably went off the middle and that has saved me from hitting people a number of times.

Good review of it. I couldn't agree with this more:

Very true. I like the idea of tables too but you really can't on sidewinder, the pitch is too steep for most of it. In my mind nether JFBB or Blue can pull off a table line for that reason. When you do see a line of tables it is usually on a section that is basically flat. The only place I could see is right before the cement mixer put in legit 20' table instead of the little 8' one they have had. I'm not sure where you would have to drop from for that but I feel like if you stop a little higher it would be perfectly doable. The little one doesn't make much sense leading into that feature, I always had to either skip that jump or not have enough speed for the cement mixer because if you hit it a reasonable speed for that feature you overshot the little jump by a mile.

I almost NEVER comment negatively on people trying to sell gear, but I have to in this case. DO NOT BUY THESE BOARDS. 1) Those prices are insane. Cut them in half and you are getting closer 2) The Vapor is an OK board, but it is what it is. Very light, but not very stiff. It is an intermediate riding board for $900 MSRP. Not to say people can't rip with it (look at Keir go), but if you gave me a choise between a T6 and a Vapor, I'd take the T6. If you gave me a choice between a Custom X and a Vapor, I'd take the Custom X. And there are about 5 or 6 other boards from other manufacturers I would take over it too. 3) This guy isn't an established member - sounds like a scam to me. I don't know why he has 3 years worth but normally if he just this years I would chalk him up as a guy from a shop who stole a pro-form and is selling the Vapor under a new name so he doesn't get caught. We had that happen at my shop, guy took a pro form and never came back and we called up Burton to cancel the order (which they did). He was far from the first person to try it. 4) When the Burton rep came to teach us about the boards, he totally trashed the Vapor. "You know the guy who comes in driving a Porsche and wearing a Rolex, this is the board for him, you can show him the weight difference and he'll know he has gotten something for his money. Everyone else will know how much he spent. But best of all it is an intermediate board so he will ride well on it." Straight from the horses mouth, you can't make this shit up. We put it up on the wall so everyone could see it when they walked in, but I never pushed it. The rep Burton rep was mostly right, we did sell 2 out of 3 to douche bags with rolexes, but one had a Lamborghini and one had a BMW. The 3rd went at our tent sale for like $350.