Johnny Law Posted December 13, 2012 Report Share Posted December 13, 2012 Spring always opens before BC...they blow the heck out of that one trail. And they can drain whatever creek that is. Water is not a concern at Spring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 13, 2012 Report Share Posted December 13, 2012 (edited) This. Global warming or not, winters are warmer. BC needs to be ready for this, and prepared to blow in marginal conditions. It's only going to get worse. They have blown snow on just about every "marginal" night so far this december. Some of you guys seem to think Bear can control the weather. And what employee did you talk to you at BC? Edited December 13, 2012 by burton71 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 (edited) Some of you guys seem to think Bear can control the weather. And what employee did you talk to you at BC? Dude, please. It's amazing what you don't know about BC and how its run. If you are going to drop 10's of millions of clams into a winter focused resort, you damn well better have your homework done and adapt to the lousy weather in this area. Shroetel doesn't seem fit to manage the restroom at a truck stop, let alone a sizeable resort such as BC. Not to compare it with Doe mt in any large way, but the employees there stuck around for a long time because they were taken care of felt a sense of loyalty, something Mark doesn't get. Interesting about Blue Mt. though, they did a nice job with the lodge and out front area. I'm stoked to hear they may plan further expansion and maybe take on BC for a slice of that off-hill business. They have the cash and land to do it. Edited December 14, 2012 by Winter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 Dude, please. It's amazing what you don't know about BC and how its run. If you are going to drop 10's of millions of clams into a winter focused resort, you damn well better have your homework done and adapt to the lousy weather in this area. Shroetel doesn't seem fit to manage the restroom at a truck stop, let alone a sizeable resort such as BC. Not to compare it with Doe mt in any large way, but the employees there stuck around for a long time because they were taken care of felt a sense of loyalty, something Mark doesn't get. Interesting about Blue Mt. though, they did a nice job with the lodge and out front area. I'm stoked to hear they may plan further expansion and maybe take on BC for a slice of that off-hill business. They have the cash and land to do it. I actually know a lot about BC, how it is run, and I know a lot of people that work there. I just have realistic expectations for what they can and cannot do...like being unable to control the weather. I just don't hold a grudge or hate against it like you do...LOL race team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 I actually know a lot about BC, how it is run, and I know a lot of people that work there. I just have realistic expectations for what they can and cannot do...like being unable to control the weather. I just don't hold a grudge or hate against it like you do...LOL race team. I dont believe anyone is alluding to BC controlling the weather. It's that they aren't doing enough with the weather they've been dealt. I'm not a BC hater either, i just think a small handful of people, namely one in particular, is ruining what is a really nice place. I feel for the employees, i feel for any business who relies on BC to open and stay open well into early spring. But again, mis-management is affecting you and thousands of others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 And how often are our temperatures in the winter average? Those averages include much cooler times...Allentown has a lot to do with Bear Creek cause temperatures are similar. Never thought the concept of "average" would be too difficult for someone on here to understand. I need to lower my expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 I dont believe anyone is alluding to BC controlling the weather. It's that they aren't doing enough with the weather they've been dealt. I'm not a BC hater either, i just think a small handful of people, namely one in particular, is ruining what is a really nice place. I feel for the employees, i feel for any business who relies on BC to open and stay open well into early spring. But again, mis-management is affecting you and thousands of others. Give me a break, you have been hating on BC on here non stop since they got rid of the race team. Back up your mis-management claims. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 Give me a break, you have been hating on BC on here non stop since they got rid of the race team. Back up your mis-management claims. Guess i need to lower my expectations as well. I've been on here since 2007, long before the race team was dumped. Guess they could really use their money now, eh? I'll entertain your nosey question, so lets start... - got rid of the most honorable and helpful ski shop owner and his shop, 2011 - got rid of Franco, the loooong time manager of all food services and also one of the most loyal and hard working people in the business I know, 2011 - got rid of the race team which brought in just about 6 figures of income each season DESPITE the weather, 2011 - got rid of Helen, the enthusiastic trails end manager, because she questioned Mark menu and pricing changes (that one is rumor but beleived to be accurate) - got rid of several culinary groups over the years with a flurry of them leaving since 2005 - pissed off numerous departments heads most notably grooming and snow making, and to a lesser degree lifts and on-hill maintenance, since Mark started in 2000. - got rid of Michele (last name escapes me but began with a 'G'), a highly dedicated and energetic manager with an office right next to BC Mark. She was apparently fired for questioning Mark on his recent actions of all of the above including getting rid of the race team, 2011 There are other minor issues but hopefully this states my case. You understand that I used to frequent that place a lot and spend good money? You starting to see why I'm pissed? Keep thinking its a magical place and pray for snow cuz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast21602 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 (edited) Guess i need to lower my expectations as well. I've been on here since 2007, long before the race team was dumped. Guess they could really use their money now, eh? I'll entertain your nosey question, so lets start... - got rid of the most honorable and helpful ski shop owner and his shop, 2011 - got rid of Franco, the loooong time manager of all food services and also one of the most loyal and hard working people in the business I know, 2011 - got rid of the race team which brought in just about 6 figures of income each season DESPITE the weather, 2011 - got rid of Helen, the enthusiastic trails end manager, because she questioned Mark menu and pricing changes (that one is rumor but beleived to be accurate) - got rid of several culinary groups over the years with a flurry of them leaving since 2005 - pissed off numerous departments heads most notably grooming and snow making, and to a lesser degree lifts and on-hill maintenance, since Mark started in 2000. - got rid of Michele (last name escapes me but began with a 'G'), a highly dedicated and energetic manager with an office right next to BC Mark. She was apparently fired for questioning Mark on his recent actions of all of the above including getting rid of the race team, 2011 There are other minor issues but hopefully this states my case. You understand that I used to frequent that place a lot and spend good money? You starting to see why I'm pissed? Keep thinking its a magical place and pray for snow cuz. LOL, that isn't mis-management. Those are management decisions and a bunch of heresy. You really think that Doe / BC could have gone from where they where in 99 to where there are today without a few good people getting let go and some employees being upset? Welcome to the business world, its a tough place...have a Coke and smile. There is a lot that goes into business decisions that you have no clue about and it is rarely ever just, "they were a great person and they just happened to disagree with so and so., so they were let go." And sometimes good people are replaced with better people. And I don't think BC is magical or perfect, I'm just realistic. I don't blame them for bad weather, local business struggles, etc... when it has nothing to do with them. Edited December 14, 2012 by burton71 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 LOL, that isn't mis-management. Those are management decisions and a bunch of heresy. You really think that Doe / BC could have gone from where they where in 99 to where there are today without a few good people getting let go and some employees being upset? Welcome to the business world, its a tough place...have a Coke and smile. There is a lot that goes into business decisions that you have no clue about and it is rarely ever just, "they were a great person and they just happened to disagree with so and so., so they were let go." And sometimes good people are replaced with better people. And I don't think BC is magical, I'm just realistic. I don't blame them for bad weather, local business struggles, etc... when it has nothing to do with them. Really? Not mis-management? Heresy? Those are hard facts bro, and most of those issues happend recently. Do your research. I think we all agree BC took off from its humble roots and impressed us all. Sure thing, there were mis-steps along the way but as you said, business is a tough and lots go into every decision. But starting in 2007, something changed and not for the better. I dont know a thing about you Burton, but if I had to guess, you do not own a business. I do. I fawk up now and again, sit down at might with a beer and contemplate as to what i did wrong. But in the morning, I make sure all my employees understand that I'm not perfect and I'll learn from my mistakes in order to make our workplace thrive. It would seem BC is not doing this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 Really? Not mis-management? Heresy? Those are hard facts bro, and most of those issues happend recently. Do your research. I think we all agree BC took off from its humble roots and impressed us all. Sure thing, there were mis-steps along the way but as you said, business is a tough and lots go into every decision. But starting in 2007, something changed and not for the better. I dont know a thing about you Burton, but if I had to guess, you do not own a business. I do. I fawk up now and again, sit down at might with a beer and contemplate as to what i did wrong. But in the morning, I make sure all my employees understand that I'm not perfect and I'll learn from my mistakes in order to make our workplace thrive. It would seem BC is not doing this. Yes, hearsay. You don't know why Helen or Michele were let go, you even admitted it was a rumor. You don't know the business decisions behind those or other changes. Just because you disagree with a decision doesn't make it a bad one. From a strict consumer / patron point of view BC has made strides every year to improve the guest experience, including 2007 to today. And for the most part they have succeeded. There have been some bumps along the way (like getting rid of the bucket of cheese fries!) , but it has been mostly positive. Along with that I know more than a handful of very happy employees that continue to work at BC year after year that have nothing but good things to say about Marc and the rest of management. I also know a few that feel the opposite...but that can be said about every company. That doesn't mean the place is mis-managed or doomed, etc... From the business side, I have started and sold two of my own companies, I know how to run a successful business (and an unsuccessful one lol). I have had to make difficult and unpopular decisions that I'm sure people without all the information would think were bad. I've also been on the other side of the coin, working for a very large company (F500) and I have questioned all kinds of management strategies and decisions. Anyway, I'm off to drink and scrape the wax off my board for this weekend. Have a good night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 Yes, hearsay. You don't know why Helen or Michele were let go, you even admitted it was a rumor. You don't know the business decisions behind those or other changes. Just because you disagree with a decision doesn't make it a bad one. From a strict consumer / patron point of view BC has made strides every year to improve the guest experience, including 2007 to today. And for the most part they have succeeded. There have been some bumps along the way (like getting rid of the bucket of cheese fries!) , but it has been mostly positive. Along with that I know more than a handful of very happy employees that continue to work at BC year after year that have nothing but good things to say about Marc and the rest of management. I also know a few that feel the opposite...but that can be said about every company. That doesn't mean the place is mis-managed or doomed, etc... From the business side, I have started and sold two of my own companies, I know how to run a successful business (and an unsuccessful one lol). I have had to make difficult and unpopular decisions that I'm sure people without all the information would think were bad. I've also been on the other side of the coin, working for a very large company (F500) and I have questioned all kinds of management strategies and decisions. Anyway, I'm off to drink and scrape the wax off my board for this weekend. Have a good night. If that's all true, then you quantified your response, fair enough. FWIW, the only thing i'm not 100% sure of the Helen incident. The rest is very much the truth. The common employee at BC (and most larger companies) are very removed from upper level management so of course, they only see and care about the job at hand and are glad for that paycheck. But the closer you get to the offices, the more disfunction exists. Beyond the management at BC, one should look into the affairs of the owner and his corporation. Nothing comes up as illegal, but some of the dealings of his is downright shady, one of which was how he took ownership of Doe from Bill Buzzbee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 I like turtles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justo8484 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 i'm mostly just bummed that they keep upping prices for food at the bar. the beer selection has stayed consistently good, with prices being fair in my opinion, but the food keeps getting ritzier and pricier. when i'm done skiing, i want a beer and a burger, or wings, or something generally not healthy. if you wanna have fancy menu options, fine, but they have at least two restaurants there, and the one is rarely open on weeknights. i'd bet that the bulk of the weeknight crowd is more into burgers after skiing than filet or grilled salmon or that sort of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HouseMuzik Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 As far as Pinnacle, what BC did there was a completely dick move.. he was told months before the end of his lease that they would not renew, unless I have my facts wrong. And I think this was done after they knew he had sold off to Buckman's. Burton, you can stick up for BC all you want, but there is a legitimate belief among local winter sports enthusiasts that bear is fucking up, and worse every year. Like i said, Blue is hot on its tail, and if the rumors of a hotel/resort ever materialize, its gonna be lights out. PS - I am not going to disclose the identity of one of our customers to you on a message board. He told me what he did in confidence, not for me to out him. But he's not the only person that walk through my door from that place. There's a lot of crap going on there behind the scenes, and we hear it. Its the same thing.. $$'s over actual product. and may i say i'm shocked that the guns are on? lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 (edited) Like i said, Blue is hot on its tail, and if the rumors of a hotel/resort ever materialize, its gonna be lights out. If Bear was sitting still, maybe. But if one of BC's expansion plans which they put together over the last 2 years come to fruition it will take a very long time for Blue, and everyone else, to catch up. That's cool if you don't want to say who it was I was just wondering if it was someone I knew. And why wouldn't the guns have been on? The weather was there so they blew snow...like have every chance they have this season. Edited December 14, 2012 by burton71 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ride Delaware ? Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 If Bear was sitting still, maybe. But if BC's expansion plans which they pitched in 2010 / 2011 come to fruition it will take a very long time for Blue, and everyone else, to catch up. What expansion plans? Must have missed that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 (edited) What expansion plans? Must have missed that... There were a few different ones, but the idea behind most of them was the same. Basically building a resort town center with retail, commercial, and residential (buy and rent) space. Think something like Stratton, but smaller. Goal is to increase off snow revenue and year round activity to help support and fund the mountain. When I heard about it was pretty early stage stuff, but they are at least thinking about it. Edited December 14, 2012 by burton71 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast21602 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 i think a "resort town" would be tough in an economy like this. but a trail expansion might help. i'm not sure what they do/don't own out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitar73 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 Bear Creek can say its like the Poconos without the drive. lol! that's too funny, yo... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toast21602 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 Yep, still looking way thin up there. They should be able to blow again tonight but nothing that will get them enough to open. Maybe a small hike park or something at most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASKIINGSUCKS Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 That's just frost, I had the same amount of white on my yard this morning down the road from BC. Hike park? Isn't it supposed to rain from saturday til tuesday?? This weather is why I don't blame em for not blowing early. Just seems like a waste of resources. I guess it's up to them to carry the local ski retail industry though so they are totally dropping the ball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burton71 Posted December 14, 2012 Report Share Posted December 14, 2012 Someone on facebook mentioned something about a hike park but no way its happening with that little snow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.