Help with Binding Problem? Salomon Warden

[SallyCat]

Long story, but in June I bought a pair of skis in Mammoth, CA, and had them mounted. Skied them the next day, and later in the day they started squeaking really badly. I also noticed some movement in the toe (my boot moving within the toepiece, i.e.)  Brought them back to the shop, which looked them over, did a round of release tests, tightened a screw in the toepiece and told me they were good to go. 

 

The next day the squeaking resumed, so I brought them to the Mammoth Mtn. ski shop for a second opinion. The guy there said they looked ok, but that I had three different DIN settings between the two skis. No idea why that would be the case.

 

So, I skied my creaky skis for the rest of the trip. I kept asking around, though, and I've been told that squeaking could be a sign of a bad mount and to check for space between ski and binding. There is very visible space. Also, the heel lever on one of the skis is loose (see video): 

 

https://facultyjacobin.com/2017/08/08/temp-file-salomon-warden-ski-binding-heel-lever/

 

I'm back in PA and wondering what to do with these skis. If they were mounted improperly, can they be fixed? If not, what do I do next?

 

Here are pics of the space between ski and binding:

 

 

[moe ghoul]

Never heard bindings squeak before. Never saw space between properly mounted binding and ski. That alone is a potential for moisture getting into the screw holes and/or vibrating loose over time. They may require a shim, or need to be remounted.

[SallyCat]

Thanks, I was afraid of that. Just didn't seem right (the gap). 

 

If I have to remount, I'm going to get different bindings. The heel lever problem is super sketchy, and nothing about these bindings gives me confidence. Will contact Salomon and see what they say. 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

They messed up...end of story.

[moe ghoul]

Thanks, I was afraid of that. Just didn't seem right (the gap). 

 

If I have to remount, I'm going to get different bindings. The heel lever problem is super sketchy, and nothing about these bindings gives me confidence. Will contact Salomon and see what they say. 

That's a good idea. Check with your local ski shops if they handle Salomon warranty issues as well. Let us know the outcome, hopefully they'll take the bindings back and credit you for a new set if its a manufacturing defect.

[SallyCat]

Funny, I posted the same question on PugSki prior to posting here and didn't get any replies.  Then just now there was an angry flurry.

 

I made a half joke about giving the bindings a bad review and the whole thread went to DEFCON 1 ALERT.  A bunch of people piled on about how Salomon is a "good company" (no argument from me there, btw.) and that their other bindings have been around forever and are great. So I shouldn't write a bad review of these bindings. 

 

It feels like they're trying to gaslight me. Funny and strange bit of intense brand loyalty there!

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

SallyCat how did you find out about Pugski? Philpug used to post on PASR and came to blue mountain back in 2007 because he lost a bet with me.

[SallyCat]

SallyCat how did you find out about Pugski? Philpug used to post on PASR and came to blue mountain back in 2007 because he lost a bet with me.

 

I think when Epic closed down I heard about it. My first year skiing I had a LOT of questions, so I read forums pretty regularly. Thanks to Epic members, e.g., I now have a whole tuning workshop in my basement and can take care of everything on my skis except base grinds and binding work. 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

I think when Epic closed down I heard about it. My first year skiing I had a LOT of questions, so I read forums pretty regularly. Thanks to Epic members, e.g., I now have a whole tuning workshop in my basement and can take care of everything on my skis except base grinds and binding work.

 

Wow just wow I've been skiing since 1991 and atomic Jeff tunes my skis a few times a ski season but I often go 20-30 days between tunes. Unless it's sticky spring snow I can deal with no wax as I have plenty of mass to go fast.

 

You sound handy..do you do your own oil changes??

 

Sally hopefully we see a lot of you at Blue on Saturday and Sunday mornings and night skiing this season

[SallyCat]

Wow just wow I've been skiing since 1991 and atomic Jeff tunes my skis a few times a ski season but I often go 20-30 days between tunes. Unless it's sticky spring snow I can deal with no wax as I have plenty of mass to go fast.

 

You sound handy..do you do your own oil changes??

 

Sally hopefully we see a lot of you at Blue on Saturday and Sunday mornings and night skiing this season

Actually I'm not at all handy by nature, having grown up in the suburbs of Long Island with parents that always just "called a guy" to fix stuff, and then becoming a historian/teacher. It was mostly just wanting to have well-tuned skis and not having a lot of money. But I've really enjoyed the learning process and I love being able to take care of my gear. It's a very pleasant zen-like escape from grading and planning to go down in the basement with a beer, listen to a podcast, and so some waxing and tuning. 

 

I will definitely be at Blue as much as possible this winter. Look forward to meeting some PASRS!

[guitar73]

Unless it's sticky spring snow I can deal with no wax as I have plenty of mass to go fast.

 

Don't need to tune your skis when you don't make turns!

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

Don't need to tune your skis when you don't make turns!

I make turns out west when it's steep enough that I need speed control. Nothing at Blue requires turns.

 

 

I hyper carve the hell out of the middle turn on switchback and on nightmare to dream weaver. Wooo

[Johnny Law]

DIN soles will squeak in a AT binding if the toe height is wrong.

 

Different DIN is because the forward pressure is jacked and the only way it could hit the actual release value is to dick with the indicator settings. Your also moving around in the binding because as the ski flexes the binding is moving around too much and your loosing forward pressure. Older soli bindings used to do this with the wing screws.

 

The mount may or may not be bad, the gap could be as simple as they needed to run the screw in a bit deeper but it's more likely the hole is stripped. If it's stripped you can either move the binding or drop a heli-coil in. Above avg shops can do heli-coils sometimes.

 

This isn't Solly fault, it's whomever mounted them did a quarter ass job and didn't even bother to cover it up properly.

 

This is why I say almost anyone can mount their own shit, it's eight holes. Nobody is going to care about your shit more than you, take your time, get the right bit and a good number 3 pozi driver and you'll do a way better job than 90% of shops.

[SallyCat]

 

This is why I say almost anyone can mount their own shit, it's eight holes. Nobody is going to care about your shit more than you, take your time, get the right bit and a good number 3 pozi driver and you'll do a way better job than 90% of shops.

 

Thanks, I'm definitely going to learn to do my own mounts. I can always just bring it to a shop for a release test. Way cheaper than a mount anyway. 

[guitar73]

This is why I say almost anyone can mount their own shit, it's eight holes. Nobody is going to care about your shit more than you, take your time, get the right bit and a good number 3 pozi driver and you'll do a way better job than 90% of shops.

 

um, most ppl don't know the minutia of how bindings work and how they are supposed to be mounted. that's why there are ski shops with ppl who are trained to do such things. for me, i wouldn't touch my bindings with a ten foot pole unless i got the proper training.

[GSSucks]

um, most ppl don't know the minutia of how bindings work and how they are supposed to be mounted. that's why there are ski shops with ppl who are trained to do such things. for me, i wouldn't touch my bindings with a ten foot pole unless i got the proper training.

 

With the right bindings and a little bit of mechanical aptitude it is really easy, I have mounted plenty of skis over the past few years. Granted I also design mechanical things for a living, so that may help my case. 

[toast21602]

With the right bindings and a little bit of mechanical aptitude it is really easy, I have mounted plenty of skis over the past few years. Granted I also design mechanical things for a living, so that may help my case. 

 

I don't and I centered a binding with a make shift plumb bob millionaire. It can be done if you have two hands and a brain and a friend with the drill bit.

[guitar73]

With the right bindings and a little bit of mechanical aptitude it is really easy, I have mounted plenty of skis over the past few years. Granted I also design mechanical things for a living, so that may help my case. 

 

 

I don't and I centered a binding with a make shift plumb bob millionaire. It can be done if you have two hands and a brain and a friend with the drill bit.

 

oh, I'm not saying one can't physically mount a binding...I'm talking about understanding how to correctly set the binding such that the installation is in accordance with the manufacturer's installation instructions and tolerances. those issues are what help keep the manufacturer's warranty in place, among other things. more power to you if you are willing to take on that risk to figure out how to get the binding correctly set, getting the proper spacing btwn heel and toe piece, maintaining the proper clearances around the heel and toe lugs of the boots, etc.

 

I'm sure there is lots to be said for being able to have such control of your set-up in order to precisely get the settings you feel is the best for how you ski and in what type of terrain you ski. for me, I trust the shop tech to have a handle on these things based on the information I provide.

 

I say all this in the context that I am a risk-adverse person, lol!

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

What toast doesn't mention is he's friends with Justo who used to work at Nestors.

[GSSucks]

Its not rocket science, most ski techs are high as a kite 95% of the time and paid $12 an hour, do you think they really care? Clearly they dont, see the OP's problem above...... 

[SallyCat]

To be clear, mounting a binding isn't something I'd do after watching a YouTube video or something; just that if I ever have the chance to get real training, I would jump at it.

 

I brought those bindings back to the shop that mounted them, and they looked them over and said they were fine. So, whomever did the mount messed up and then the shop tech didn't even notice.  Maybe the same person, I dunno. 

[toast21602]

What toast doesn't mention is he's friends with Justo who used to work at Nestors.

 

selling gear, not drilling holes. 

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

Well he did a good job mounting my Shiros

Edited August 10, 2017 by GrilledSteezeSandwich

[Johnny Law]

Its not rocket science, most ski techs are high as a kite 95% of the time and paid $12 an hour, do you think they really care? Clearly they dont, see the OP's problem above...... 

 

Bingo. Maybe 1% of techs are ski scientists the rest are people who want a job in a ski town that doesn't piss test.

 

 

um, most ppl don't know the minutia of how bindings work and how they are supposed to be mounted. that's why there are ski shops with ppl who are trained to do such things. for me, i wouldn't touch my bindings with a ten foot pole unless i got the proper training.

 

Bindings are super super simple devices, they are certainly not high precision. Most of a binding is for show, they haven't changed since like 1960 in terms of how they actually work. A look nevada from 1972 and brand new FKS are pretty much the same binding. Materials are different and you got some minor advancements to help get the boot out like afds and rollers but they work exactly the same.

 

Companies almost always put their tech manuals on-line so if you want to know exactly how the techs do it you can get the same training they do which is three pages of pictures and two dummy mounts on a 2x4.

 

Everyone is free to do as they wish but outside of a couple of places here and there nobody will do a better job than you because nobody cares half as much as you do. For every OGE in Burlington or Skiworks in Killy (Excellent techs) there's Back Country Experience in Durango (Great store, horrible techs) who on a remount with new boots charged my brother, took the skis for almost two days and didn't do a god damn thing. Seriously they drove the heal piece to full forward and gave them back. He was full indigio (dude you gotta dial that FP up), hanging on by the binding wing nubs. Buckmans one time on ptex job for a cousin of mine ground pretty much new skis down to .01mm rather than just do actual decent ptex work. Wicks waaaay back in the season rental days didn't reset din and rented my sister a pair with the din all the way backed out. The rental shop at the bottom of Highlands gave my sister's fiance a pair of MX 98's with three stripped heal screws which is a great way to end up dead in the woods. I could go on forever. 

 

Even if you don't want to do your own work inspect inspect inspect when you get your stuff back. Gaps, stripped screws, mismounts etc etc etc I don't leave until I've checked whatever they've done and it's all good. Every time I click in I do the kick thing with the shake on both skis to check forward pressure, if a ski needs to be ground ask the dude for a linear base structure if he doesn't know what your talking about understand all your getting is them throwing it on the machine and handing it back to you which is fine but you should know. If you got a fancy at setup take ten mins dicking with them and understand how they work so when you go to the shop you can talk to the guy and you'll know in 15 seconds if they know what they are doing.

 

We go downhill at highway speeds on nothing more than a hunk of wood, plastic, epoxy and 1/8" metal edges, alot of times drunk, trusting random ski tech X is not a good idea. Great people but not trustworthy by default.

[GrilledSteezeSandwich]

I'm getting excited for ski season