GrilledSteezeSandwich Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 1 hour ago, JFskiDan said: I signed up today with Chesco, thinking i will have better odds with them than Delco. First, Delco doesnt actually have their own Health Dept, they kinda work off of Chester County's. And second, its probably unlikely the vaccine will be administered at Wawa's and Acmes, so pretty much most of Delco is fucked right from the get go. Nice it’s cool that smokers can be in first round Quote
JFskiDan Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 Just now, GrilledSteezeSandwich said: Smokers can sign up now JFDan That makes me crazy btw. Im really a weekend smoker, and i just dont see how doing that moves one up on the list. Quote
GrilledSteezeSandwich Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 1 minute ago, JFskiDan said: That makes me crazy btw. Im really a weekend smoker, and i just dont see how doing that moves one up on the list. Because smokers are more likely to have bad Covid complications that send them to the hospital. Same with obese people. Quote
toast21602 Posted January 22, 2021 Author Report Posted January 22, 2021 2 minutes ago, JFskiDan said: That makes me crazy btw. Im really a weekend smoker, and i just dont see how doing that moves one up on the list. Worse clinical outcomes for smokers. Quote
Schif Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 6 minutes ago, toast21602 said: Worse clinical outcomes for smokers. No doubt, but this brings up a huge ethical question. Why prioritize people who made the conscious decision to put themselves in a higher risk category for the disease? Quote
GrilledSteezeSandwich Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 2 minutes ago, Schif said: No doubt, but this brings up a huge ethical question. Why prioritize people who made the conscious decision to put themselves in a higher risk category for the disease? It’s not about that. It’s about vaccinating people who are the highest for hospitalizations in order to ease the burden on hospitals. Yes a non smoker can say they smoke as well to cut the line..it’s an honor system. 1 Quote
JFskiDan Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 16 minutes ago, Schif said: No doubt, but this brings up a huge ethical question. Why prioritize people who made the conscious decision to put themselves in a higher risk category for the disease? This is what i am struggling with as well. Quote
toast21602 Posted January 22, 2021 Author Report Posted January 22, 2021 20 minutes ago, GrilledSteezeSandwich said: It’s not about that. It’s about vaccinating people who are the highest for hospitalizations in order to ease the burden on hospitals. Yes a non smoker can say they smoke as well to cut the line..it’s an honor system. Correct Quote
Schif Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 5 minutes ago, JFskiDan said: This is what i am struggling with as well. Clearly those in charge of making this decision didn't struggle much with it considering the way things are currently defined. I listened to https://www.thisamericanlife.org/729/making-the-cut this podcast yesterday and act 1 is about a panel of people put together to decide which applicants were given the chance to use one of the first dialysis machines invented. Ethical decision making, especially in a medical context, is fascinating to me. Balancing individuals vs the greater good is a very tricky thing to do for anyone with a conscience. Quote
Schif Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 2 minutes ago, toast21602 said: Correct As much as it's correct is it a valid thing to do by directive? Example: A ship is sinking and there aren't enough lifeboats (Pre Titanic days). There is a collegiate swim team on board. The captain makes the directive that the swim team is not allowed to get in any lifeboats as they have the best chance in the water. This is a problematic situation. The ideal situation would be that the lifeboats were open to all and the swim team would volunteer themselves to get in the water on their own. Quote
toast21602 Posted January 22, 2021 Author Report Posted January 22, 2021 26 minutes ago, Schif said: No doubt, but this brings up a huge ethical question. Why prioritize people who made the conscious decision to put themselves in a higher risk category for the disease? But it doesn’t. When triaging patients for priority care I don’t care what their causative factors were, if they are compliant with treatment, if they live a sedentary life, what they eat, etc. done if the life decisions people make are because of the cards they were dealt, socioeconomic status, etc. and really have not much of a choice with how their lives have played out. Quote
toast21602 Posted January 22, 2021 Author Report Posted January 22, 2021 Wish I could contribute more as the lone healthcare professional here, but I have to get back to vaccinating those who are at highest risk 😀 1 Quote
mbike-ski Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 2 hours ago, NMSKI said: Lucky! dammit, not obese enough! Quote
trackbiker Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 1 hour ago, toast21602 said: Nice! I’m giving out more vaccines this afternoon to first responders in Bethlehem. I think you volunteered for this IIRC. Way to go and thanks! 1 Quote
GrilledSteezeSandwich Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 24 minutes ago, JFskiDan said: This is what i am struggling with as well. I had ethical issues about doing the payroll protection program...there’s a second round now and my Dad was bugging the hell out of me to apply and cash flow and business is great but he’s like just take it, it’s free money. It’s for struggling businesses. 1 Quote
GrilledSteezeSandwich Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 7 minutes ago, mbike-ski said: dammit, not obese enough! I kind of think you are if you’re 6 feet tall and 230. Quote
JFskiDan Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 13 minutes ago, toast21602 said: Wish I could contribute more as the lone healthcare professional here, but I have to get back to vaccinating those who are at highest risk 😀 Well, then, again, TFTI. 1 1 Quote
JFskiDan Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 4 minutes ago, GrilledSteezeSandwich said: I had ethical issues about doing the payroll protection program...there’s a second round now and my Dad was bugging the hell out of me to apply and cash flow and business is great but he’s like just take it, it’s free money. It’s for struggling businesses. I see that, and raise you the ethical issue of anybody here actually needing the second stimulus check. They should be paying more attention to those that are in need, rather than those that go skiing and enjoy sausage sunday. 1 1 Quote
toast21602 Posted January 22, 2021 Author Report Posted January 22, 2021 1 hour ago, JFskiDan said: Well, then, again, TFTI. How much is it worth to you @JFskiDan?? 2 Quote
indiggio Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 3 hours ago, toast21602 said: Oh baby! Unfortunately I can only get it in one inch deep 😮 Just the tip! 1 1 Quote
GrilledSteezeSandwich Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 8 minutes ago, indiggio said: Just the tip! @saltyant this is grate 1 2 Quote
Justo8484 Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 3 hours ago, JFskiDan said: I see that, and raise you the ethical issue of anybody here actually needing the second stimulus check. They should be paying more attention to those that are in need, rather than those that go skiing and enjoy sausage sunday. my understanding (albeit limited; i'm just a lowly computer nerd, not an expert in fiscal policy) was that it's faster, easier, and therefore actually cheaper to just make a blanket policy that gives everyone the stimulus check than it is to go through the process of putting together a program and a team, figuring out who falls into what bracket, etc. only to inevitably have some people slip through the cracks on both sides anyway. 3 Quote
Schif Posted January 22, 2021 Report Posted January 22, 2021 2 hours ago, Justo8484 said: my understanding (albeit limited; i'm just a lowly computer nerd, not an expert in fiscal policy) was that it's faster, easier, and therefore actually cheaper to just make a blanket policy that gives everyone the stimulus check than it is to go through the process of putting together a program and a team, figuring out who falls into what bracket, etc. only to inevitably have some people slip through the cracks on both sides anyway. This seems extremely reasonable. Plus at least part of this is to try to stimulate the economy. I think that a decent amount of people would take the money and spend it in some way shape or form helping out the economy. 1 Quote
JFskiDan Posted January 23, 2021 Report Posted January 23, 2021 3 hours ago, Justo8484 said: my understanding (albeit limited; i'm just a lowly computer nerd, not an expert in fiscal policy) was that it's faster, easier, and therefore actually cheaper to just make a blanket policy that gives everyone the stimulus check than it is to go through the process of putting together a program and a team, figuring out who falls into what bracket, etc. only to inevitably have some people slip through the cracks on both sides anyway. no, you are right, its just a blanket policy, and would take forever to figure out who actually needs it, and who doesnt. then the people that dont get it feel as though they are entitled to the same benefit, and then theres riots, and people wearing new Nike's and Timberlands.......and it drives the country further apart. 1 Quote
JFskiDan Posted January 23, 2021 Report Posted January 23, 2021 4 hours ago, toast21602 said: How much is it worth to you @JFskiDan?? Whats it gonna take for you the be the dirty cop? 3 car washes, 2 oil changes, 4 bags of Cheddar Horseradish kettle chips, a portable pizza oven for the lot? am i getting there? 1 1 Quote
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