The Anti-Bode

[DHarrisburg]

results in a grown man bashing a kid on this MB

 

oh hay what's going on in this thread

[sibhusky]

oh hay what's going on in this thread

It started out about Bode and suddenly Papasteeze was calling skidude a racer wannabe or something. Well, it wasn't a direct aim, more of a sideways swat. Oddly I'd found myself on PS's side for a bit there, being as how I am SICK TO DEATH OF THE WORLD ANALYZING BODE. Maybe he was actually swatting at ski999 and skidude stood up and received the blow instead. Not clear.

Edited March 15, 2006 by sibhusky

[Ski]

Still waiting on Bode's retraction for spreading FALSE rumors about a true American hero, which doesn't appear to be coming. Poor rich, drunk Bode.

 

'Dude and Rob know I don't race competitively, so it was clear who he was directing the wannabe towards. He'd also said basically the same thing recently.

 

It's tough to explain a certain type of passion to a casual ski racing observers like Assasin. I'll try to explain it on baseball terms:

 

Just because someone is a huge baseball fan, doesn't mean you don't boo an opposing player, even if he's a great player. Has Manny Ramirez ever been cheered at Yankee Stadium? Has Jeter ever been cheered at Fenway?

 

Ask any great player what he thinks about being booed in a visiting stadium and they always say, "It's a sign of respect for what I'm capable of doing against their team. Bring it on."

 

And I'm saying booing, not racial attacks, or anything like that.

 

Think about it, Assasin. Try telling a Packer fan not to boo a Viking. How about telling a Cowboy fan to go easy on TO, because TO is just misunderstood?

 

World Cup ski racers are like teams, in a way. They have legions of supporters that follow them from race to race. There are good guys and bad guys; friendly one's and jerks. In fact, fans even go too far, such as when Croatian fans through snowballs at Anja Paerson during a GS last year.

 

World Cup racing isn't a junior sport; these are often millionaire professional athletes vying for worldwide fame. Bode used a platform his fame allowed to call Lance a cheater, citing a fake French tabloid story. When Bode showed class early in his career, I rooted for him. But when he started to bitch about the FIS, his teammates, and real heros, he lost a lot of support.

 

Demanding people 'leave Bode alone' is like demanding people not bash basketball players that go into the stands after fans throw beer on them.

 

I'd like to hear what your favorite pro sports team is...

[4 more wars]

It's tough to explain a certain type of passion to a casual ski racing observers like Assasin.

 

I'd like to hear what your favorite pro sports team is...

 

I'm several times over a national champion, and twice world champion youth wrestler who blew his body apart and can't compete anymore. I know all about passion and watching my weight and not eating junk food... I can honestly say that I never had a drink in the entire time I was involved in the sport. Not a single time. In short, I know what passion is, and I know all about not being out and partying EVER, not just before a race.

 

My favorite sports team is the Kansas City Chiefs, which I think are a GREAT analogy for Bode...

 

See, the Chiefs are always awesome during the regular season... they usually play pretty good(not for a few years, but still) all the way up until the AFC championship game, when they blow it to the Steelers or the Chargers or the Broncos(the year the broncos won the superbowl, no less)

 

But I always cheer for the Chiefs. No matter how many times Tony Gonzales beats up his girlfriend or gets a drug charge, or whatever... no matter how many times they lose, or get into fights... or... DRINK UNTIL AN HOUR BEFORE A GAME!!! Your analogy is really insulting, in that you assume I know nothing about passion for skiing...

 

I am VERY passionate about it, which is why I defend someone who does it for fun--even at Bode's level. He's out having a good time. What the hell good is having money and being young if you aren't spending the money and being young?

[DHarrisburg]

Still waiting on Bode's retraction for spreading FALSE rumors about a true American hero

 

Dang, first Bode has beef with Lance Armstrong, but now he's just taken it too far...

 

 

[Papasteeze]

I really love the stereotypical racer wannabe.

 

Hmmm - let's analyze that statement and the response. Everyone who responded to it, took as some type of negative hate. I rest my case on the stereotype HOLY CRAP !!! Exactly at the same time I am typing this, I caught a CNN byte about Bode "all the hate mail he is recieving." What the hell is the matter with you guys?

 

 

It started out about Bode and suddenly Papasteeze was calling skidude a racer wannabe or something.

 

Hmmmm.. wrong, there is no singular person in that comment and is not negative, but ironically there are people who have obviously taken it that way. Matter of fact it is an exclamation of adoration, can't you guys read? Interesting, any psych majors on here?

 

 

Okay here is the Bode segment....... Bode said that he doesn't care, that all the hate mail just confirms what is wrong with the attitude in the sport. I concur.

Edited March 15, 2006 by Papasteeze

[mbike-ski]

Bode lives to ski another day...http://www.usskiteam.com/public/news.php?dId=2&sN=1&aId=2109

I guess his knee his hurting though. I thought the idea of the MB was a place for opinions.. (and have a little fun at Bodes expense). The only hating on here is directed at those with a different opinion?!?!?!

[Ski]

Your analogy is really insulting, in that you assume I know nothing about passion for skiing...

 

I am VERY passionate about it, which is why I defend someone who does it for fun--even at Bode's level. He's out having a good time. What the hell good is having money and being young if you aren't spending the money and being young?

 

"I never even cared that Skiing was an Olympic sport until this past year, honestly--and I skied from the time I was very little. It's a HOBBY of mine... aside from Freestyle and Moguls, I think skiers are prissy old ladies and preppy douchebags"

 

Assassin, perhaps you're posting a lot of this just to be a devil's advocate? That's fine. And it's actually pretty clear.

 

Bode finished 2nd today, which makes it even more of a bummer that he blew off the Asian swing. In football terms, it's like he 'came alive' after he'd been eliminated from the playoffs. By the end of the season, most ski racers are beaten up and hobbled. Walchhoffer, last year's DH Overall Champ, rushed off to a previously scheduled knee surgery after the final race. He had already clinched prior to the race, but felt it was his job to still compete.

 

Back to my analogy: What if Ben Roethlisberger went on NFL Today and called John Elway a cheater and said all his records should be stripped, all because of something he'd read in the National Enquirer?

 

Would you be cheering for Roethlisberger the next time the Steelers came to town? If you belonged to a football MB, would you be telling people that Roethlisberger is a breath of fresh air and everyone else should shut up?

Edited March 15, 2006 by ski999

[Papasteeze]

I think giving out a PASR members phone number on new schoolers is alot worse than sending Bode hate mail.

 

Who did that?

 

 

The only hating on here is directed at those with a different opinion?!?!?!

 

Yeah by a few individuals. No biggie, its the same old debate that has been going on here forever. Most don't participate.

[4 more wars]

Back to my analogy: What if Ben Roethlisberger went on NFL Today and called John Elway a cheater and said all his records should be stripped, all because of something he'd read in the National Enquirer?

 

Would you be cheering for Roethlisberger the next time the Steelers came to town? If you belonged to a football MB, would you be telling people that Roethlisberger is a breath of fresh air and everyone else should shut up?

 

I would NEVER cheer for the Steelers. They have enough refs on their side. Bode Miller is a skier... skiing is a sport, a hobby, etc... it's chess on 2 planks strapped to your feet. It's just a game, dude.

[Papasteeze]

I thought I would add something that is positive and worthy of reading about Bode.

 

Stolen from another board.

 

 

 

WHAT MAKES BODE MILLER SO FAST?... Should we be trying to ski like him?

 

When I watch Bode Miller win a slalom race on television it?s often not immediately obvious to me how he beat everybody by two seconds? and I?m a very experienced ski coach. When I review the videotape and I?m still mystified, it helps to refer back to a short list I have in my head of the physical factors behind speed through a course. I ask myself, ?How does that technique:

? reduce friction,

? reduce impacts that slow him down,

? create forces that speed him up,

? help him to use gravity more effectively,

? shorten the distance he skis from start to finish,

? increase (or decrease) consistency.? (Crashing is slow.)

It?s a good list of questions, referring as it does to basic principles, rather than just asking whether the racer uses ?approved? techniques.

 

To see what I mean let?s use this list to analyze Bode?s moves.

 

 

REDUCING FRICTION

Bode makes very clean turns. He carves more of each turn than most, reducing skidding friction. He was the first of all of today?s World Cup racers to switch to shaped skis, and he?s learned very well how to smoothly roll those skis way up on edge cleanly at the top of his turns. The resulting very tight arcs require less ?steering? of his skis in a run, hence less drag. Also, he knows when to go straight and close to the vertical combination gates to minimize turning friction, and he knows how to come down on a pivoted ski?s edge with minimal skidding for turns that are very off-set.

He is also a master of not allowing his skis to skid at the bottom of his turns: by not overturning and by weighting the tails enough to prevent them from spinning out.

 

 

FORCE MANAGEMENT--REDUCING UP-COURSE FORCES

Bode?s technique reduces impacts that slow racers down, like: pole plant jolts, impacts from slalom poles, and pushes from his arcs that shove him up the hill and slow him down.

He knows how to use point forward pole plants for unweighting, balance, and control, but he only uses such pole plants when he has to, because they brake.

Bode is tall and clears slalom poles by allowing them to strike his pole guards high on each slalom pole. This minimizes pole plant impacts by increasing his leverage against the return spring and against the moment of inertia of the pole. Being large Bode is relatively heavy and has the momentum needed to minimize the slowing affect of slalom pole impacts. (If you are short and light you are handicapped in slalom.)

He reduces negative thrusts from his skis, by not over-turning or hitting his edges harder than necessary at the end of each turn, when the forces through his skis on his body point up course. That?s why he doesn?t create a big extension coming out of most turns, but just moves his hips horizontally across his skis and forward to start the next turn. This move requires that he come out of turns with his butt low, behind his ski-boots briefly, but creates a smooth transition with no hard hit on his edges. He hunches forward to minimize backward imbalance and then works hard to pull his hips forward going into the next turn. (He only extends up coming out of a turn if the course is very back and forth and unweighting is required to allow him to pivot his skis into the next turn without grinding.)

He makes good use of his height by leaning in at the top of his turns, minimizing the amount that his mass must be deflected back and forth by his skis as he flows through the course. He?s not afraid to touch his inside hand down at the top of his turns to help him find his balance when tilting in.

 

 

FORCE MANAGEMENT -- INCREASING DOWN COURSE FORCES

He seems to understand how to generate speed after the start and in flatter, slower course sections by pushing against his skis with the proper early timing in each turn. He uses skating steps to accelerate when he?s going very slowly.

 

 

SKIING A SHORTER LINE

As the Austrians began to master short shaped-ski slalom technique three or four years back they learned that the technique of keeping hips low, close to the snow, with feet wide apart generated big edge angles, bent skis and powerful tight carved turns. Unfortunately this got translated by many coaches and racers into the dogma that feet should always be wide apart. However, in vertical combinations where the turns are not greatly off-set, it still pays to stand up a little, get feet close together, and ski as close to the gates as possible, using quick but gentle knee-angulated carved turns. The difference in the amount of turning between different flush lines can have a huge effect on speed. In a flush, a relatively straight, tight line requires far less turning force, racer movement, edging, turning out of the fall-line, and line-length, than one that?s only a little further from the poles. On the other hand, if the gates below a flush are very off-set, running flushes too straight and fast can bring a racer into the next turns disastrously low. These days flush running requires a lot of attention by racers and coaches to find the optimal line for various course sets.

 

CONCLUSION

Because his slalom skiing sometimes looks awkward and unbalanced, I expected in my analysis to find many aspects of Bode?s technique inefficient and risky, and not for general consumption. Indeed there are some moves involving excessive rotations and counter-rotations to question. Still, much of what he does makes sense, like:

? Tilting in at the top of wide turns,

? Putting down the inside hand when necessary to help find balance at big lean angles,

?Coming back on his skis at turns? end to get out of the turns cleanly, and limiting extension,

?Running many vertical combinations with feet less than two feet apart.

 

 

Each of these moves runs counter to some widely accepted coaching dogma and it?s tempting to suggest that we should be teaching every kid or Masters racer to ski slalom like Bode. But few have Bode?s strength and agility, and it?s probably best to first teach a somewhat more balanced and reliable technique? before experimenting with some Bode-like moves.

 

Keep your mind open. Coaches seldom, if ever, discover something new that?s fast, and we?ve set back U.S. racing before by squashing funny looking technique and/or equipment that we should have analyzed and used intelligently, in order to stay ahead of the competition. Remember. You don?t come second in the World Cup with a lot that?s wrong. It?s time to start finding and using the best from Bode.

 

 

 

Thanks to Coach Al Hobart for this article.

[Ski]

I would NEVER cheer for the Steelers. They have enough refs on their side. Bode Miller is a skier... skiing is a sport, a hobby, etc... it's chess on 2 planks strapped to your feet. It's just a game, dude.

 

I forgot...it's a game played by us "sissy old lady douchebags".

&

Freestylers and bumpers are the only real athletes that on skis.

 

 

 

Hey, you're sure welcome to your opinion. I think it's hilarious.

 

Thanks to Coach Al Hobart for this article.

 

Thanks, Rob. Some of us were lucky enough to be with Al while he was reviewing tapes and came up with that thesis. Al is the greatest ski mind in the US!

[Papasteeze]

Thanks, Rob. Some of us were lucky enough to be with Al while he was reviewing tapes and came up with that thesis. Al is the greatest ski mind in the US!

 

 

Humph.. I am confused then yeah yeah yeah - so what else is new, right? I think it is one hell of an interesting piece. The descriptions in the mechanics of Bode's slalom turn really give me something to sink some teeth in... What I am confused with is what is so god awful wrong with also taking a harder look at the principles behind MSRT?

[4 more wars]

I forgot...it's a game played by us "sissy old lady douchebags".

&

Freestylers and bumpers are the only real athletes that on skis.

Hey, you're sure welcome to your opinion. I think it's hilarious.

Thanks, Rob. Some of us were lucky enough to be with Al while he was reviewing tapes and came up with that thesis. Al is the greatest ski mind in the US!

 

I spend part of my summers heli skiing in Alaska... usually not very long, but at least a week a year. Through that, I have come up with a couple of ideas...

 

1. Trails are for wimps.

2. If you can't break every bone in your body, you aren't pushing hard enough.

3. Nature doesn't groom trails

4. Once you take the NATURE aspect out of skiing, it becomes synthetic and boring

5. Noone but you cares what your vertical is for this, or any season

 

Most importantly:

 

On First descents, noone knows how far, fast, or how much vertical you got--but there is a HUUUUUUGE difference in being the first person to make a descent down the face of a mountain in Alaska and getting first in NASTAR...

 

You do it for medals, I do it to keep from killing people like you.

 

I think Papasteeze has the right idea... he's pushing his kids to follow their dreams, funding those dreams, making them do the work it takes to reach those goals--but at the same time, he realizes that after all the money and work and driving and injury and work and money and money and money and work--the odds are, his kids will never be professionals.

 

Does that mean that he doesn't keep pushing them, or that they don't keep working? Hell no!!! In the end, it's the pursuit that was really fun. What do you do once you reach the top? Nothing. At a certain point, if you don't have fun with it, it will consume you. I would rather have a good time and take dead last, than to have a crappy time and win a gold medal.

[Ski]

Humph.. I am confused then yeah yeah yeah - so what else is new, right? I think it is one hell of an interesting piece. The descriptions in the mechanics of Bode's slalom turn really give me something to sink some teeth in... What I am confused with is what is so god awful wrong with also taking a harder look at the principles behind MSRT?

 

I read every word Gary wrote. I studied every photo and every graphic. I came up with an opinion I won't repeat.

 

But character counts to me and that's where the rancor enters.

[skidude]

Let me know how that back country skiing/glade skiing is going for you at CB.

[Papasteeze]

I read every word Gary wrote. I studied every photo and every graphic. I came up with an opinion I won't repeat.

 

But character counts to me and that's where the rancor enters.

 

Okay enough said then, thanks.

[beachiegirl2ski]

article on bode on aol sports news its long here is the link

 

http://articles.news.aol.com/sports/articl...S00010000000001

[Ski]

I spend part of my summers heli skiing in Alaska... usually not very long, but at least a week a year. Through that, I have come up with a couple of ideas...

 

1. Trails are for wimps.

2. If you can't break every bone in your body, you aren't pushing hard enough.

3. Nature doesn't groom trails

4. Once you take the NATURE aspect out of skiing, it becomes synthetic and boring

5. Noone but you cares what your vertical is for this, or any season

 

Most importantly:

 

On First descents, noone knows how far, fast, or how much vertical you got--but there is a HUUUUUUGE difference in being the first person to make a descent down the face of a mountain in Alaska and getting first in NASTAR...

 

You do it for medals, I do it to keep from killing people like you.

 

I think Papasteeze has the right idea... he's pushing his kids to follow their dreams, funding those dreams, making them do the work it takes to reach those goals--but at the same time, he realizes that after all the money and work and driving and injury and work and money and money and money and work--the odds are, his kids will never be professionals.

 

Does that mean that he doesn't keep pushing them, or that they don't keep working? Hell no!!! In the end, it's the pursuit that was really fun. What do you do once you reach the top? Nothing. At a certain point, if you don't have fun with it, it will consume you. I would rather have a good time and take dead last, than to have a crappy time and win a gold medal.

 

Are you that guy from the movie Stripes? What the heck was his name...oh, yeah: Francis!!!!

 

Lighten up, Francis....

[4 more wars]

Are you that guy from the movie Stripes? What the heck was his name...oh, yeah: Francis!!!!

 

Lighten up, Francis....

 

rofl.

 

don't look at me, don't talk to me, don't touch me, don't touch my stuff!

[poconoceancity]

I'm several times over a national champion, and twice world champion youth wrestler who blew his body apart and can't compete anymore. I know all about passion and watching my weight and not eating junk food... I can honestly say that I never had a drink in the entire time I was involved in the sport. Not a single time. In short, I know what passion is, and I know all about not being out and partying EVER, not just before a race.

 

My favorite sports team is the Kansas City Chiefs, which I think are a GREAT analogy for Bode...

 

See, the Chiefs are always awesome during the regular season... they usually play pretty good(not for a few years, but still) all the way up until the AFC championship game, when they blow it to the Steelers or the Chargers or the Broncos(the year the broncos won the superbowl, no less)

 

But I always cheer for the Chiefs. No matter how many times Tony Gonzales beats up his girlfriend or gets a drug charge, or whatever... no matter how many times they lose, or get into fights... or... DRINK UNTIL AN HOUR BEFORE A GAME!!! Your analogy is really insulting, in that you assume I know nothing about passion for skiing...

 

I am VERY passionate about it, which is why I defend someone who does it for fun--even at Bode's level. He's out having a good time. What the hell good is having money and being young if you aren't spending the money and being young?

 

What years were you a national champion? Who did you wrestle for in college? What weight class were you in when you were injured and no longer able to compete?

[Ski]

article on bode on aol sports news its long here is the link

 

http://articles.news.aol.com/sports/articl...S00010000000001

 

Interesting article, Beachie...earlier this year, Schlopy said he hadn't hung out with Bode in over a year. They'd even rented a house together in Europe, before Bode got his bus. He'd said they were best buds, then fame just took Bode off into his own world. Now Bode's eating chips and hangin' with a teammate? It's just one line out of an article, but it's at least a positive sign. Hopefully, it's not just the publicist he hired to work on his image.

[skidude]

I didn't think he cared about that image. He doesn't like to be in the spotlight, according to him, right?

 

If you are going to complain about being in the spot light for what you said, why would you say it. If he watned to get wasted before every race then not tell anyone, most people wouldn't know, and wouldn't care. But since he has now mulitpul times said that he drinks and races...well thats just stupid.

[Papasteeze]

But since he has now mulitpul times said that he drinks and races...well thats just stupid.

 

 

c'mon dude, quit bringing it back up if it bothers you so much. Todays skiers are so much more tame than the european antics that went on in the past. I do not know all the ski racer characters by name but if some of them were doing what they did then, today...

 

Face it, even our beloved CB plasters posters at the top of the lifts for alchoholic brews. Free tickets for samples etc etc .. alchohol is part of the scene. Why not call out CB for promoting and setting a poor example, why single out one very very talented individual? It could be that a lot of them are doing the same thing, we just don't know about it. Props to Bode for his honesty, it's refreshing in this day and age. If every one wants to get on thier high-horse so much, why not lobby to have alchohol on the list of banned substances. Afterall it is a stimulant, correct?

 

He doesn't drink and race, don't be silly. Does anyone know that infamous night when his last drink was and when his starting time was? BTW - do you know Wina? I thnk she told me she was there. It's not rocket science to estimate blood achohol content at the time of the race. Sure he admits feeling bad caused by being out late, but imagined how Lyndsey must have felt, I bet she was hurting a lot more. it's just another impairment. Props to both of them for even trying to race.

 

Matter of fact can you imagine how ratings would go up if guys were hurling themselves at 80mph while drinking. We all could get sponsored by our favorite brands. Lets have some fun with all of this. Extra points for skiing under the influence, now that takes some real balls to be that stupid. To hell with 80mph, lets add some additional difficulty to it. NASCAR would be so boring with out wrecks, lets make em drink before the race. Sarcasim.........

 

 

Edit: please don't say that not getting enough sleep hurt his performance. I just recently read an article where the skier was so nervous that she hadn't slept in days prior to her GOLD!

Edited March 15, 2006 by Papasteeze

[skidude]

c'mon dude, quit bringing it back up if it bothers you so much. Todays skiers are so much more tame than the european antics that went on in the past. I do not know all the ski racer characters by name but if some of them were doing what they did then, today...

 

Matter of fact can you imagine how ratings would go up if guys were hurling themselves at 80mph while drinking. We all could get sponsored by our favorite brands. Lets have some fun with all of this. Extra points for skiing under the influence, now that takes some real balls to be that stupid. To hell with 80mph, lets add some additional difficulty to it. NASCAR would be so boring with out wrecks, lets make em drink before the race. Sarcasim.........

 

That might have been the dumbest thing I have ever head, in my life. It takes balls to ski durnk....I feel like I just lost 5 points off my IQ saying that. It takes the same amount of balls to ski drunk as it does to drive drunk.

 

How you run your life is one thing, but I'm honestly kind of shocked that as a parent you encorage this kind of behavour, and encourage people to drink more. Well its not my kid thats going to be dead when his H12 hits a building because he was drunk when he got in to drive (maybe at 10 after he was done skiing drunk).

 

Whatever makes you happy man, its your life.

 

Face it, even our beloved CB plasters posters at the top of the lifts for alchoholic brews. Free tickets for samples etc etc .. alchohol is part of the scene. Why not call out CB for promoting and setting a poor example, why single out one very very talented individual? It could be that a lot of them are doing the same thing, we just don't know about it. Props to Bode for his honesty, it's refreshing in this day and age. If every one wants to get on thier high-horse so much, why not lobby to have alchohol on the list of banned substances. Afterall it is a stimulant, correct?

 

Actully I did call out a few of the sam adams people, as well as asked Camelback employees if Camelback condoned skiing and drinking, or skiing drunk. No one really knew what to say.

 

Edit: please don't say that not getting enough sleep hurt his performance. I just recently read an article where the skier was so nervous that she hadn't slept in days prior to her GOLD!

Don't worry, Bode got plenty of sleep. He slept from around midnight til 11...